»THe cookie«

here's a really funny theory

My friend beleives that the cookie that the Oracle Makes are what trigger the "One" (I find this funny, but a good possibility)
After watching the trailer you see Smith (laughing in an evil manner) in the Oracle's kitchen with all the cabinets open...

I can totally imagine Smith eating the cookie of power then laughing malevolent knowing he has all the power now.

what do you think?

I admit it is funny

It is funny. Think about what would happen if she dropped a tray of cookies out the window. You would have a lot of cats and dogs in the alley chasing eachother in bullet-time.

Well, why not? "Cookies" in a computer system let a website download faster later on.
The symbolism is perhaps too easy for the people with computer knowledge, but will be lost on those who have never heard the term "computer cookie".

The question is: what kind of code/information do the cookies in the scene contain?

Correction: the cookies do not accelerate the loading times. Their purpose is to store certain data on the client side, because "browsing" is stateless -- so here come cookies and provide persistent storage.

Actually, I see little to no connection here. (Maybe the cookie is programmed to increase cholesterole level of the One )

yeah cookies are not a program

But it is funny, I beleive that the Cookie signifies something else. I think in the SECOND MOVIE the RED CANDY SIGNIFIES THE ORACLE's knowlege or advice.

Neo asks "DO you already know if i'm going to take it?"
Then shes sys "I wouldn't be much of an oracle if I didn't"

So the candy is a symbol of of the Oracle's knowledge, and she loves candy. I find this ot be a better explanation to the whole update through the mouth thing.

peace

If neo is a really a human-becoming-software , then surely the cookie
is a binary patch. So is the pill, the candy and, why not, the drink that cypher gives
to him .

Cookiemonster wrote:

here's a really funny theory My friend beleives that the cookie that the Oracle Makes are what trigger the "One" (I find this funny, but a good possibility) After watching the trailer you see Smith (laughing in an evil manner) in the Oracle's kitchen with all the cabinets open... I can totally imagine Smith eating the cookie of power then laughing malevolent knowing he has all the power now. what do you think? I admit it is funny

I really really liked this theory...

It's good because in the Matrix Revolutions trailer, we see Smith doing some things he couldn't before, for example when Neo has to jump up high in the air because Smith is "flying" towards him through the broken wall...

So maybe you are totally right, or maybe just to an extent... nice one!!

In the Matrix the question is:

WHAT IS REAL?

I think one of the questions from Reloaded is:

WHAT IS CONTROL?

Maybe the question to revolutions is:
WHAT IS HUMAN?

Think about what the oracle said"
[Neo} touched the source, and separated his mind from his body"
if Neo had indeep separated his body from his mind and his mind was trapped in a world between the Matrix world and machine world.
(this proves the existance of MORe than one dream worls if you actually TRUST the oracle)
Then is he NO LONGER HUMAN? (maybe once your mind is free of thier body you can hide in the Matrix making exiles not only programs, but also minds, maybe seraph is ONE and that's why he shines, maybe the merovingian is one, and that's why he has lived longer than any human)

Morpheus: "The body can't live without the mind"

BUT Can the MIND live without the body?

IF SO what is difference between humans and machines after ALL
Remember that machines were created by humans so in a WAY the Matrix was created by humans so the SOURCE could might as well be, fuck me freddy, THE HUMAN MIND.

ALSO
"machines are keeping us alive, while other machines are trying to kill us"
Machines could say
"Humans are keeping us alive, while other humans are trying to kill us"


YOUR THOUGHTS

Andromeda wrote:

In the Matrix the question is: BUT Can the MIND live without the body? YOUR THOUGHTS

No, because in M1 Cypher unplugs some of Morpheus's team in the real world, and they drop dead in the Matrix...

Plus, in Revolutions when Neo gets stuck between the Matrix and the real world, he's still alive in Zion... but of course, if Zion is a Matrix too, then anything is possible...

Furthur thoughts anyone?

I'm convinced that the cookie is a program meant to make Neo follow the path of The One. The thing that finally did it for me is that on the DVD for The Matrix, the chapter title is "Choices... and a cookie". Has anybody else noticed this?

Very good points.
In both movies, the eating of food usually symbolises Noe's acceptance of someone or their idea. This is shown when the oracle gives the cookie and the candy, the red pill itself, besides being a tracing deviece, and when cypher gives the "engine degreaser" and his piece of mind.
Possibly why Neo doesn't eat any of the offerings in Zion?

Just a thought - please respond

actually, now that I think of it, where did those offerings come from? I thought that the only food in Zion was protein/nutrient mixture stuff.

I think maybe the cookie planted the dream Neo was having

Something else I think a lot of people dont pick up on is that she says he'll feel "right as rain"... ("door on your left- your other left") (aparently the showdown is in the rain too from the previews) Perhaps there is some sort of something in the cookie to make Neo want to go right? I dunno, just an observation (which may be totally meaningless)

I can see it all now

*Smith eats one of the Oracle's cookies*

Smith: I have seen the top of the mountain, and it tastes like oatmeal

well, to prove his point about causality, the mero delivers the "cake." he doesn't call it cake tho, he calls it a program. i never really put much thought into it, but it has been mentioned a lot before. the oracle is always feeding neo. i wouldn't think that cookies make him the one tho. after all the architect says, neo is created to be the one. his programming is different. there isn't any indication that just because he ate a cookie he became the one.
maybe tho, the food is programming that is a set of already "made" choices. maybe that is why the oracle says, "you've already made the choice, you just need to understand why you made it." He has already made the choices that direct him on the path of the ONE because those choices are programmed into him. I.e. going to save morpheus, and such. it could even be that all the choices except the one he makes in front of the architect are in fact scripted. that is why the oracle is so sure of what is going to happen all the time. in reloaded tho, you get the feeling that she isn't so sure what will happen to trinity. that's because trinity's life depends on what door Neo chooses. in Enter the Matrix, the oracle says that even she cannot see past the end of the path, or the choice of the left door or the right door.

i would think it would be possible for neo to have power to control some programming in the matrix, but still have choices already made by programming.

ie. If this {morpheus kidnapped}
then {Save him}
If this {6 weeks have passed by}
then {visit the Oracle}

Wel.. But when does he make those choices? And when does he try to understend em?

if the chioces are already made, programmed, it doesn't matter when he makes them. the point is that he has already made them. that's why the oracle and neo have that whole conversion around him taking the candy or not. neo says, "if you know whether or not i'm going to take the candy, do i really have a choice." she replies, you've already made the choice, you just need to understand why you made the choice.

so, your other question, he understands why he made a choice at the time of the choice. with the candy, he came to the point where he was to choose to eat the candy, and at that point knew that "mmmmm, i like candy, therefore i chose to eat it."

hell, in the end i don't really know, i'm just trying to find logic behind her statements that somehow his choices are already made

0x587e1a2c wrote:

...i would think it would be possible for neo to have power to control some programming in the matrix, but still have choices already made by programming. ie. If this {morpheus kidnapped} then {Save him} If this {6 weeks have passed by} then {visit the Oracle}

Wel... a good point but i think Neo is a human being with the possibility to change the code in the matrix like hacker can change the content on you r computer... So Neo could be like an Hacker into the Matrix and not an part of it...

etse wrote:

Wel... a good point but i think Neo is a human being with the possibility to change the code in the matrix like hacker can change the content on you r computer... So Neo could be like an Hacker into the Matrix and not an part of it...

true, but somehow we have to explain that dispite all of neo's hacking abilities and power to change code, he did exactly what he was made to do. all of his choices added up to the same path that was walked before i.e. Birth, Life, Visit the Architect, make a choice. somehow he did exactly what the machines had made him for. the architect says that the anomaly (Choice) is undesirable but not without a measure of control. if you don't buy into the fact that neo can change most code, but has some things he can't change, like his path to source, how do you explain him ending up at the source 7 times?

In an online Chat, the Wachowskis were asked about the cookie scene.

Apparantly there was some of the original stuff not inlcuded in the scene for one reason or another.

They replied something to the effect that there was a very in-depth and significant point to the cookies, which was far too long and complex for an online chat.

And that's the last I've heard on the subject.

I dont think this theory is so far fetched. Neo was NOT the one when he originally visited the Oracle (he had the gift, thats for sure), but I believe that the cookies were actually a "booster code" to actually turn Neo into The One. (Each line of code building on the other...) Why would Agent Smith be so preoccupied with Neo's code overwriting part of his own... why was Agent Smith so "compelled to stay"... why was Agent Smith ALREADY in the hallway when Neo was there.... why did Agent Smith(s) ALL look towards the door when the keymaker opened it? Maybe Agent Smith had an overwhelming urge to open a door of light? Hmmm...

The Merovingian (sp?) showed that code can easily be written into items (like food) in order to chemically manipulate the human body. The cake the woman ate actually overloaded her oxytocin levels to the point of her not caring "why" she was haveing an orgasm. The Architect actually hinted at how the Oracle ("Please.."-->meaning "I created her, why do you call HER an oracle?") stumbled upon giving humans "hope" for thier future which would give machines a 99% success rate for keeping humans under control. I believe the Oracle was acting DIRECTLY on the behalf of the Architect: find an gifted human, give him code to reload the Matrix, repeat. Its her purpose. Neo never really bothered to ask why he was doing what he was doing, he only followed everyone elses orders (actually being controlled by Morpheous in a way). The Oracle did say that "the only way to get through this is together" meaning we all have a part to play... we supply you with a fake reality and you supply us with battery power. We are symbiotic now, and we cant survive without each other.

The only thing I can find wrong with this is that the Oracle also told Trinity that she would fall in love with the One. Why would the Oracle plant such a kink into an otherwise harmonious system of control? She had to know what would happen, but she also thought that Neo had already made his choise and simply had to understand why he did. I dont think anyone knew Neo would choose the other door...

Sorry if this is hard to follow, I tried to cover alot of ground.

Remind me to log in next time (stupid first post noob!)

Right now I am eating Peanut Butter Chocolate Chip Cookies...I wonder what kind of cookie the oracle was making. Oooh...I am hungry.

Andromeda wrote:

In the Matrix the question is: WHAT IS REAL? I think one of the questions from Reloaded is: WHAT IS CONTROL? Maybe the question to revolutions is: WHAT IS HUMAN? Think about what the oracle said" [Neo} touched the source, and separated his mind from his body" if Neo had indeep separated his body from his mind and his mind was trapped in a world between the Matrix world and machine world. (this proves the existance of MORe than one dream worls if you actually TRUST the oracle) Then is he NO LONGER HUMAN? (maybe once your mind is free of thier body you can hide in the Matrix making exiles not only programs, but also minds, maybe seraph is ONE and that's why he shines, maybe the merovingian is one, and that's why he has lived longer than any human) Morpheus: "The body can't live without the mind" BUT Can the MIND live without the body? IF SO what is difference between humans and machines after ALL Remember that machines were created by humans so in a WAY the Matrix was created by humans so the SOURCE could might as well be, fuck me freddy, THE HUMAN MIND. ALSO "machines are keeping us alive, while other machines are trying to kill us" Machines could say "Humans are keeping us alive, while other humans are trying to kill us" YOUR THOUGHTS

I really like this, ive toyed with the possibility of neos mind remaining in the matrix while his body in the real world is dead, possibly explaining that scene of the squiddy impacting him in the real world and the red-world.

- Klay