»war«

Hi i'm new but have been lurking and reading.

I wanted to point out that the movie and the animatrix shorts where about one primary thing....war.

The war began because an AI didn't want to die so he fought back against a human. Programs that didn't want to be deleted (ie die) followed Merv into the Matrix to hide. Smith was the program who was to destroy Zion (keep fighting the war with the humans) and to search out and find the "exiled programs" who were helping the humans.

Neo was indeed human but he represented the humans "choice" either to keep fighting or to make peace.

The other AI esp the Oracle believed (program for faith? Sati the program for Hope?) that if the humans would make the "choice" to stop the war and the "program" (Smith)which caused the machines to keep trying to destroy the humans was deleted there would be peace. Hence her telling Neo "everything that ha a begining has an end." The end of the war came the way it started with a machine "Smith" who "knew what he was suppose to do" (die be deleted because he lost his purpose) fighting a human.

Just a thought or two.

Abi

abigail wrote:

Hi i'm new but have been lurking and reading. I wanted to point out that the movie and the animatrix shorts where about one primary thing....war. The war began because an AI didn't want to die so he fought back against a human. Programs that didn't want to be deleted (ie die) followed Merv into the Matrix to hide. Smith was the program who was to destroy Zion (keep fighting the war with the humans) and to search out and find the "exiled programs" who were helping the humans. Neo was indeed human but he represented the humans "choice" either to keep fighting or to make peace. The other AI esp the Oracle believed (program for faith? Sati the program for Hope?) that if the humans would make the "choice" to stop the war and the "program" (Smith)which caused the machines to keep trying to destroy the humans was deleted there would be peace. Hence her telling Neo "everything that ha a begining has an end." The end of the war came the way it started with a machine "Smith" who "knew what he was suppose to do" (die be deleted because he lost his purpose) fighting a human. Just a thought or two. Abi

first of all welcome to the forum. you've got some got ideas for a newbie.

however i do not believe that smiths purpose is to destroy zion, after all the machines need zion to keep all the non believers who are making the system unstable.

i think the reason he wants to destroy zion is because, as we learned in m3, he is (for some unknown reason) neo's opposite. now think about this: as neos time in the real world gets longer, he becomes more attached to zion and the rest of the real world.

therefore smiths hate of zion and the real world grows. this explains why he wants to destroy zion and later on in m3, the entire real world.

abigail,
are you aware that the Bhagavad Gita was an important influence on the Matrix trilogy?
The Gita is considered by most Hindus to be the single most representative sacred text of the faith, and it is the acknowledged source book of Yoga philosophy.

Arjuna, a warrior prince, and Krishna, an avatar (reincarnation) of Vishnu (the all-inclusive deity), have ridden out into the middle of a battlefield, with armies arrayed on either side of them, just before the battle has begun, signaled by the blowing of conch shells. Seeing friends, teachers and relatives in both armies, Arjuna is heartbroken at the thought that the battle will cost him many loved ones. He turns to Krishna for advice....

I suggest that you read this essay about the Gita which deals with war and destruction. It might shed a new light on the trilogy:

intyoga.freeservers.com...

Also I believe that Neo is much more than that:

Quote:

Neo was indeed human but he represented the humans "choice" either to keep fighting or to make peace.

I think this article can help us understand his role in the trilogy:
hinduwebsite.com...

I know that there are many layers and meanings to the matrix. I wasn't trying to say that war was the only point in the movie just that it was one that stood out to me

Quote from above essay:

All this is not to say that strife and destruction are the alpha and omega of existence, that harmony is not greater than war, love more the manifest divine than death or that we must not move towards the replacement of physical force by soul-force, of war by peace, of strife by union, of devouring by love, of egoism by universality, of death by immortal life. God is not only the Destroyer, but the Friend of creatures; not only the cosmic Trinity, but the Transcendent; the terrible Kali is also the loving and beneficent Mother; the lord of Kurukshetra is the divine comrade and charioteer, the attracter of beings, incarnate Krishna. And whithersoever he is driving through all the strife and clash and confusion, to whatever goal or godhead he may be attracting us, it is - no doubt of that - to some transcendence of all these aspects upon which we have been so firmly insisting. But where, how, with what kind of transcendence, under what conditions, this we have to discover; and to discover it, the first necessity is to see the world as it is, to observe and value rightly his action as it reveals itself at the start and now; afterwards the way and the goal will better reveal themselves. We must acknowledge Kurukshetra; we must submit to the law of Life by Death before we can find our way to the life immortal; we must open our eyes, with a less appalled gaze than Arjuna's, to the vision of our Lord of Time and Death and cease to deny, hate or recoil from the universal Destroyer.

Agent Smith was the destroyer
I don't know the reference to Smith from the Bros but i remember reading that this scripture was for Smith

From the KJV Bible

Isaiah 54:16
Behold, I have created the smith that bloweth the coals in the fire, and that bringeth forth an instrument for his work; and I have created the waster to destroy.

Also Rama represents the law of life by death, the dead fed to the living and his role or purpose or karma to continue the circle or revolution.

ps have youread
The Rise of Endymion?

abigail wrote:

ps have youread The Rise of Endymion?

Nope, I haven't. But I guess I should?...


As for Smith,... this is from a private discussion I have going with another,... well,... fan:

Anyway,… if I go on in my approach,…. the key to the end is Smith.

“You cannot stop him, but I can”

So what is Smith?


TKW: St. Paul said, "I live, yet not I, but Christ in me." You're saying that St. Paul discovered his true Self, which is one with Christ, and this replaced his old or lower self, his individual soul or psyche.

Ken Wilber: Yes. Your ruach, or ground, is the Supreme Reality, not your nefesh, or ego. Obviously, if you think that your individual ego is God, you're in big trouble. You would, in fact, be suffering from psychoses, from paranoid schizophrenia. That's obviously not what the world's greatest philosophers and sages have in mind.

TKW: But why, then, aren't more people aware of that? If Spirit is in fact within, why isn't it obvious to everybody?

KW: Well, that's the third point. If I am really one with God, why don't I realize that? Something must separate me from Spirit. Why this Fall? What's the sin?

TKW: It's not eating an apple.

KW: [Laughing] It's not eating an apple.
The various traditions give many answers to this question, but they all essentially come down to this: I cannot perceive my own true identity, or my union with Spirit, because my awareness is clouded and obstructed by a certain activity that I am now engaged in. And that activity, although known by many different names, is simply the activity of contracting and focusing awareness on my individual self or personal ego. My awareness is not open, relaxed, and God-centered, it is closed, contracted, and self-centered. And precisely because I am identified with the self-contraction to the exclusion of everything else, I can't find or discover my prior identity, my true identity, with the All. My individual nature, "the natural man," is thus fallen, or lives in sin and separation and alienation from Spirit and from the rest of the world. I am set apart and isolated from the world "out there," which I perceive as if it were entirely external and hostile to my own being. And as for my own being itself, it certainly does not seem to be one with the All, one with everything that exists, one with infinite Spirit; rather, it seems completely boxed up and imprisoned in this isolated wall of mortal flesh.becomingme.com...

Smith was protecting the Matrix (Maya) from those threatening to wake up or those already unplugged.
The instrument of Maya in deluding mankind is the Ego. It is the Ego that distracts us from our true self.

When Neo becomes the One, he becomes aware of a reality that is beyond the “normal” perception of the Ego, beyond Maya. In a way, the Matrix code, as seen by Neo, is the “spirit” of the Matrix, the underlying reality, connecting everything.

But whereas Neo starts transcending his Ego, Smith starts becoming Ego.
Already in M1, Smith develops some sense of Ego. He starts thinking and acting in his own interest.

And I believe when he is unplugged from the system, Smith finally is Ego.

The more Neo’s power grows by transcending his Ego, the more Smith grows as Ego.

“ Yes, me. Me, me, me.”
” This is my world! My world!”

And the more Neo gets a feeling for the real purpose of life, which is to evolve and transcend, Smith’s understanding of the purpose of life degenerates, “the purpose of life is to end”.

What values does pure Ego have?

“Is it freedom or truth, perhaps peace - could it be for love?”

“Nihilism is the belief that all values are baseless and that nothing can be known or communicated. It is often associated with extreme pessimism and a radical skepticism that condemns existence. A true nihilist would believe in nothing, have no loyalties, and no purpose other than, perhaps, an impulse to destroy.”

That is Smith. And – and that’s my very own interpretation, not at all based on any knowledge about nihilism, but the above 3 sentences – this nihilism is based on pure Ego, which sees value in nothing but itself.

Ego stands in our way on our path to realize the spirit within us; and with Ego (total delusion) taking over the world,…spirit of man is lost.

That’s how I understand

“And if you can't find the answer, then I'm afraid there may be no tomorrow for any of us.”

It was the egoism in man, which caused the destruction of the sky (I consider the scorched sky and the sun above metaphors for delusion and Brahman) and an alienation between man and spirit.

And it is the destructive thunderstorm of Ego taking over the world, which heals the wounds by Neo overcoming Ego, by Neo surrendering Ego to his higher Self.

If you understand that every ending is really a new begining you won't fear it.