[Matrix Reloaded]
Merovingian: "Who has time? Who has time? But then if we do not ever take time, how can we ever have time?"
 

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»Merovingian Explained«

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Symbols in the Matrix & References to existing philosophies

 

strife

Merovingian Explained  

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The Merovingian's were an old French dynasty who had claimed they decended from the line of Jesus Christ after his resurrection and apparent life with Mary Magdaline (sp?). Being a Christian and knowing that Jesus didn't shack it up and went up to heaven after 40 days, I just want to clairify that this is _not_ a view shared by Christians. Anyhow, with that out of the way...

If the Merovingian is essentially a "decendant" from Jesus, well, first of all, who is our Jesus figure in the movie? The One. Not necessarily Neo, but any of the previous One's would have been as well. This explaination, like most Matrix explainations, requires one to understand several things.

The One code is attached to a person. That code is then sent back into the source and the Matrix is recompiled and run again. If you're at all familiar with linux administration or just linux at all, you'll know that when you skrew around with the source, you gotta go recompile it. Then you run it again and bam! The changes are applied, everything is good. Therefore, if the one is put into the source, it might make sense that the code he carries is added to the source and, once again, the One is given a choice. Be deleted or live in the Matrix. The person carrying the code does not necessarily have to be destroyed. He's more of a vessal for that code to get added in again.

If you understand that, based on numerous statements the Merovingian and Persephone makes, it is quite likely the Merovingian was a previous One. There's the account that Persephone used to have a relationship with Merovingain very similar to Trinity's with Neo's. Additionally, further evidence to support this requires understanding several other layers of information:

1. That the One and Trinity program have a child

This would give meaning to the sex scene, which no one can really explain up until this point. In Enter the Matrix, the Oracle explains that the Merovingian sold the Oracles visual code to save their son, who is very important and will save the world. Who is this? Very likely Neo. The one hole in this theory, as with most regarding the Merovigian being a previous One, is that he states he survived Neo's predicessors. If he's just been put back into the Matrix pot and seen other One's go flying by that would explain it, although it does seem like a cheap answer to a movie which doesn't offer any cheap answers.

2. That their child is the next One

Who knows why, the why we cannot understand until Revolutions is out. But once again, that sex scene is irrelevant from what we know and understand right now. I strongly believe that such a long, drawn out part of the movie holds very important significance.

Ok, that all being said, Merovingian, based on the importance the Wachowskis put on each name, is likely a previous one.

You think that's air you're breathing?
knn

Father and he son  

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1) But Trinity is not very pregnant and Revolutions taks place in the next 24 hours after Reloaded. So how does that fit?

2) Please also note, that Zion is not the normal Jewish Zion, but is related to 'Priory of Zion' ('Prieure du Notre Dame du Sion'). This is what Lambert Wilson (Merovingian) said in an interview. That might also be a hint. Also 'the elders from Zion'.

3) Neo and Merovingian being relatives. I like that. Any idea who the pushed-away guy is at the Merovingians party?

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strife

  

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1. If what is going to happen in the Matrix which I think will happen happens, then the fact that the movie is based only in a 24 hour time span won't effect it too much. If what I think is going to happen in the Matrix doesn't happen (ie: they fail), and the same thing that has happened 5 times happens for a sixth, then the movie either won't show it or ignores it. Basically, under normal circumstances it is possible the Trinity program gets pregnant and they push her back in the matrix. However, because something is a little different this time, the fact that Trinity is bearing child will have little consequence to the matrix itself (this time around).

2. I'll check up on that. There's a *ton* of Zion talk in Psalms, so I'll go do some reading.

3. Yes, I read somewhere that that is the man in Enter the Matrix who says "72 hours, last time Zion lasted only 72 hours", but I'll double check on that one. He's a casual observer in it all apparently.

knn

  

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strife wrote:

Yes, I read somewhere that that is the man in Enter the Matrix who says "72 hours, last time Zion lasted only 72 hours", but I'll double check on that one. He's a casual observer in it all apparently.


I don't think so. The 72hour man is called "trainman" and he is a bum. The pushedaway-man look more normal.

strife

  

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Well, did some research, here are some ideas which I have found...

Quote:

"I believe that the guy was the guy was one of the programs who betrayed the oracle to the Merovingian"


Another...

Quote:

"I would guess that the guy being led away from Merovingian's table in Reloaded is the father of the "special" child mentioned in ETM.

Why ?

He looks depressed & downcast as he has just betrayed someone. (i.e The Oracle)

He is being "escorted" away which suggest he is not someone who The
Merovingian would normally trust (i.e not an ally under normal circumstances)

The Merovingian appears to be in a jovial mood (as if he has just received some good news) when Neo & Co first sit down to chat with him & he asks Neo to tell the Oracle that her time is almost up.

As the trio walk in, Neo is the only one who looks across to see him being led away (almost as if he "sensed" his prescence) but does not appear to recognise him..."


More...

Quote:

"SUBZERO continues with one of the most noted observations, followed by a wild theory – “If you rewatch Reloaded you'll see just as Neo & Co. are walking towards the Merovingian's table, they show a bearded man being escorted away from that very table. He looks at Neo, the camera slows, and threatening musical overtones are heard for a brief second and then it's gone. I think he's the father of this kid the Oracle talked about, whoever the kid and the mother may be, I think he was there to give the Merovingian the key to the shell program of the Oracle. That would explain The Merovingian saying 'her time is almost up' in regards to the Oracle. He has her shell code and figures to do something with it, or initiate some kind of plan to attack her after he disposed of Neo. "


And finally...

Quote:

"Some people believe the man in white being escorted out of the Merovingian's restaurant is Seraph's father. This is because of the statements Mero makes that her time is almost up. People feel that the man in white was just making the deal at that moment, like a black market exchange of Oracle's termination code for Seraph's. One thing to remember is that Oracle said she "trusted" these programs. Unfortanutely, we don't know of too many trustworthy programs in the Matrix, nor do we know which programs are close to her. I have a feeling that these parents are programs that have yet to be introduced."


I have read many more similar posts to these ones, all discussing very much the same idea. Indeed thought provoking, although I tend to agree with the theory that this man game the Merovingian something of great value and it excited him. The Merovingian is in a fantastic mood when he meets with the gang.

knn

Fantastic  

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Phantastic post, strife!! Thank you so much. I will try to add it on my site

Ogami Itto

  

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I believe that the man being escorted away is Marcus Chong, trying unsuccessfully to score some free food.

Zion, like everything in this movie is attached to more than one meaning.

I agree that the Merovingian could be an old one, however, his is "very old. much older than the matrix." so...he might just be a program.
The whole child/parent thing is strange. But difficult to speculate on.

Trainman is a freak.

find the gate and you may walk alone between heaven and earth
knn

Rama  

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Is this pushed-away-guy played by Bernard White?

In the Reloaded cast list White is listed as "Rama-Kandra".

What the...?

emp

  

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Thats just the guy who the Merovingian hired to write the fake "Dolan" revolutions script...

Guest

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strife wrote:

The Merovingian's were an old French dynasty who had claimed they decended from the line of Jesus Christ after his resurrection and apparent life with Mary Magdaline (sp?). Being a Christian and knowing that Jesus didn't shack it up and went up to heaven after 40 days, I just want to clairify that this is _not_ a view shared by Christians. Anyhow, with that out of the way...

If the Merovingian is essentially a "decendant" from Jesus, well, first of all, who is our Jesus figure in the movie? The One. Not necessarily Neo, but any of the previous One's would have been as well. This explaination, like most Matrix explainations, requires one to understand several things.

The One code is attached to a person. That code is then sent back into the source and the Matrix is recompiled and run again. If you're at all familiar with linux administration or just linux at all, you'll know that when you skrew around with the source, you gotta go recompile it. Then you run it again and bam! The changes are applied, everything is good. Therefore, if the one is put into the source, it might make sense that the code he carries is added to the source and, once again, the One is given a choice. Be deleted or live in the Matrix. The person carrying the code does not necessarily have to be destroyed. He's more of a vessal for that code to get added in again.

If you understand that, based on numerous statements the Merovingian and Persephone makes, it is quite likely the Merovingian was a previous One. There's the account that Persephone used to have a relationship with Merovingain very similar to Trinity's with Neo's. Additionally, further evidence to support this requires understanding several other layers of information:

1. That the One and Trinity program have a child

This would give meaning to the sex scene, which no one can really explain up until this point. In Enter the Matrix, the Oracle explains that the Merovingian sold the Oracles visual code to save their son, who is very important and will save the world. Who is this? Very likely Neo. The one hole in this theory, as with most regarding the Merovigian being a previous One, is that he states he survived Neo's predicessors. If he's just been put back into the Matrix pot and seen other One's go flying by that would explain it, although it does seem like a cheap answer to a movie which doesn't offer any cheap answers.

2. That their child is the next One

Who knows why, the why we cannot understand until Revolutions is out. But once again, that sex scene is irrelevant from what we know and understand right now. I strongly believe that such a long, drawn out part of the movie holds very important significance.

Ok, that all being said, Merovingian, based on the importance the Wachowskis put on each name, is likely a previous one.
Confused

Guest

Re: Rama  

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knnknn wrote:

Is this pushed-away-guy played by Bernard White?

In the Reloaded cast list White is listed as "Rama-Kandra".

I also stumbled upon this. So I dug up a picture of Bernard White on the statenews.com.... Judging by the article that was with the photo he has to be at least 40 years old, likely older. That age might fight the guy being lead away. I also found a wikipedia on wikipedia.org..., respectively Rama (not quite the same I guess).

knn

Read this  

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wikipedia.org... says:
In Hinduism, Rama is regarded as the seventh avatar of the god Vishnu and worshipped together with his companion Hanuman, the monkey-god who assists him in the epic narrative of the Ramayana.

He is the Prince of Ayodhya and is banished to a forest by his stepmother. While in exile, his wife, Sita, is kidnapped by Ravana, King of the Rakshas on Lanka (cur: Sri Lanka). Rama, along with Hanuman, rescued her, killed Ravana and becomes King of Ayodhya.

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knnknn wrote:

Is this pushed-away-guy played by Bernard White?

In the Reloaded cast list White is listed as "Rama-Kandra".

What the...?

It is Bernard White.

knn

2 pics  

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I posted 2 pics at

matrix-explained.com...

Guest

  

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emp wrote:

Thats just the guy who the Merovingian hired to write the fake "Dolan" revolutions script
Surprised

Guest

Re: Rama  

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knnknn wrote:

Is this pushed-away-guy played by Bernard White?

In the Reloaded cast list White is listed as "Rama-Kandra".

What the...?

Drahken Kahn

Trainman  

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I think Trainman looks alot like pushed-away-man. It probably isn't, cuz his appearance wouldn't change so much over a short period of time. but pushed-away-man is a program afterall. maybe he changed his appearance like the oracle did. maybe he had to because Mero destroyed his shell as well. I don't know. I'm gonna go check the credits of ETM and see who's listed as trainman.

The Merovingian

The Merovingian of course  

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The "pushed away guy" is Bernard White I asked 2 different people and they agreed (My reloaded copy kinda sux, but I already ordered the DVD) anyway. He IS listed as the Rama-Kandra.

NOTICE the obvious HINDU connection, as his "wife" has a dot on her forehead. I want to think the termination code of the oracle is the CHILD (little girl) and that she [the child] is the oracle eyes.
THEN AGAIN... You could make a connection between the fact that the Merovingian is wants the Eyes of the oracle, and now Neo is blind folded, and it looks as if his eyes were bleeding.

DUM DUM DUM

ALSO Sir Ramachandra was the 7th Avatar of Vishnu
and Neo is the 6th ONE.
Far off connection, but an intresting one nonetheless. .

Also Sir "Parashurama" was the Sixth Avatar of Vishnu
HE camed on a time when welthy "kings" governed the world and the posed a threat to the moral relgious scholars. He went around the world 21 times and killed those kings. -Some vage connections can be made to the character Neo.
I still beleive Neo is more like the Buddha since the Buddha literally means "the one who woke up", but this whole hindu connection is confusin since the Buddha is concidered the 9th Avatar. I however can't stand people who seem so full with their own tradition and insist on comparing Neo to Jesus. Sure there are connentions, but there are far more connections to other mythologies and the matrix should be taken as the oportunity to explore those mythologies and not sink on your own.


ALSO

THe Trainman is seen twice in the trailer:
1-Punching Neo into the wall
2-Jumping across the tracks when train is coming

This guy bothers me... or the fact that I dont know his character.
ANY INFO ON THIS GUY?

SJ

Trainman  

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The Merovingian wrote:


I still beleive Neo is more like the Buddha since the Buddha literally means "the one who woke up", but this whole hindu connection is confusin since the Buddha is concidered the 9th Avatar. I however can't stand people who seem so full with their own tradition and insist on comparing Neo to Jesus. Sure there are connentions, but there are far more connections to other mythologies and the matrix should be taken as the oportunity to explore those mythologies and not sink on your own.


ALSO

THe Trainman is seen twice in the trailer:
1-Punching Neo into the wall
2-Jumping across the tracks when train is coming

This guy bothers me... or the fact that I dont know his character.
ANY INFO ON THIS GUY?


Here for info on the Trainman:

xzaust.com...


I am not sure how reliable the site is, but it popped up first on Google.

Considering the "homage" wink-wink-nudge-nudge nature of the series, don't forget that K. Reeves played Buddha in Bertolucci's Little Buddha about 8 years ago. (A marvelous little movie by the way!) So the complaint above about "Neo is a Jesus-figure" might very well be valid.

Aceventura3203

  

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Quote:

Being a Christian and knowing that Jesus didn't shack it up and went up to heaven after 40 days, I just want to clairify that this is _not_ a view shared by Christians. Anyhow, with that out of the way...

You should read the Da Vinci Code by Dan Brown. You might be surprised to find out the what you "know" about Jesus is what you have been programmed to "know" byt the roman catholic church. There are many people through out time who have believed that Jesus was married to Mary Magdalene and that this information has been purposfully obscured. Read the book. Take the red pill, again.

SJ

Fiction?  

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One should know that The DaVinci Code is of course a work of fiction, which has a good many myths and untruths in it about Christianity/Catholicism.

For a criticism of the book, visit this Masonic site, guaranteed not to be necessarily biased in favor of the Catholic Church!

masonicfax.com...

Kryptonian

Wait a minute....  

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The little girl in the preview is a child born free in the matrix. The child Sati is born to two programs....Rama-Kandra and Charra. Rama-Kandra is the "pushed-away-man". However i also think that the Kid is also of some importance...Trinity said "You know what they say about the life you save..." Even though Neo says that he didn't save him he is the reason he is free. The brothers don't do anything by accident. Also, Neo looks to be blinded in one scene where he seems to be defending against 'squidys'. I ownder if this has anything to do with Mero asking for the Oracles eyes...

Ewart

I do not beleive the Merovingian is a former One.........  

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I do not beleive that the Merovincian is a former One. There was a post earlier about the history of the Merovincians. It is true that some do think that the line supposedly came from Jesus, but this doesn't tell the whole picture. Just because there is a philosophical connection between the Morevincian (The French bloodline) and Jesus, and Neo and Jesus, that doesn't mean we can overstep ourselves and make the relationship transitive and jump to the conclusion that the Merovincian was a former One.

The key is that the Merovincian bloodline may be one of the oldest in all humanity (The New Testament takes the time to trace Jesus' ancestry all the way back to King David, Isaac, Abraham, Noah, Adam etc.) There are scholors who beleive that the Merovincian dynasty can be traced back to the dawn of time, and is somehow related to all the major develpements of civilization (agriculture, astronomy, mathematics, metallurgy, navigation, architecture, language, writing, and religion). Some believe the Merovincian family line started with Gods who ruled the world. These Gods created humans as their slaves. This tradition is common among all the major ancient civilizations (Simetic, Babylonian, Sumerian, Egytpian, Mesopotamian, Etc.) This theme of enslavement runs deep in The Matrix.

Apparantly, the Gods did not want the humans to be free, and tried to hide from them the "Arts of Civilization", but some of the Gods mated with humans, which ultimately led to a "revolution" so to speak. This tradition is also common to nearly ALL ancient cultures in some shape or form. The Merovincians are the off spring of these unions.

Obviously, the Morivengian has been seduced by power, and is vain without ego boundaries. I have no evedence to support this, but...... Certainly, the Architect was the programmer of the first Matrix (Not the movie, but the neural network in the Film) - Meaning he wrote the code. But I think it is plausable that it was the Merovincian who may have originally thought of the idea of enslaving the humans. The Architect wrote the first Matrix, which was a failure..."entire crops were lost". The Oracle was the one who realized that if you introduced "choice", then the Matrix Program could work and be accepted by the human minds. Obviously there is some relationship between the Oracle and the Merovincian. I have not played the Enter the Matrix Video Game, and have only seen "Reloaded" 5 times, so I'm not sure what it is. I would need more time to pondor the exactitudes.

To learn more:

21stcenturyradio.com...


I would argue that Neo and the Merovingian are connected somehow, but not becuase the Merovingian was a former One. I think the Merovingian serves as a contrast to Neo. The proper literary term is a "foil". This makes sence to me. If you accept Neo as Christ/Budha figure, the Merovincian could be symbolic of Satan. There is a lot a scholorly efforts that seem to draw the conclusion that Christ and Satan were brothers. Satan/Lucifer was a fallan angel, who was regected by the Supreme Lord (Jahway, Jehojah, The Lord, etc). I like this dicotomy, Merovingian as the Enslaver, Neo as the Liberator. This could explain why the Merovingian seems to be in exile in the Matrix also.

In all honesty, I don't know. But some things to consider.

Regards,
E

Phaeton

Re: I do not beleive the Merovingian is a former One........  

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Ewart wrote:

I do not beleive that the Merovincian is a former One. There was a post earlier about the history of the Merovincians. It is true that some do think that the line supposedly came from Jesus, but this doesn't tell the whole picture. Just because there is a philosophical connection between the Morevincian (The French bloodline) and Jesus, and Neo and Jesus, that doesn't mean we can overstep ourselves and make the relationship transitive and jump to the conclusion that the Merovincian was a former One.

The key is that the Merovincian bloodline may be one of the oldest in all humanity (The New Testament takes the time to trace Jesus' ancestry all the way back to King David, Isaac, Abraham, Noah, Adam etc.) There are scholors who beleive that the Merovincian dynasty can be traced back to the dawn of time, and is somehow related to all the major develpements of civilization (agriculture, astronomy, mathematics, metallurgy, navigation, architecture, language, writing, and religion). Some believe the Merovincian family line started with Gods who ruled the world. These Gods created humans as their slaves. This tradition is common among all the major ancient civilizations (Simetic, Babylonian, Sumerian, Egytpian, Mesopotamian, Etc.) This theme of enslavement runs deep in The Matrix.

Apparantly, the Gods did not want the humans to be free, and tried to hide from them the "Arts of Civilization", but some of the Gods mated with humans, which ultimately led to a "revolution" so to speak. This tradition is also common to nearly ALL ancient cultures in some shape or form. The Merovincians are the off spring of these unions.

Obviously, the Morivengian has been seduced by power, and is vain without ego boundaries. I have no evedence to support this, but...... Certainly, the Architect was the programmer of the first Matrix (Not the movie, but the neural network in the Film) - Meaning he wrote the code. But I think it is plausable that it was the Merovincian who may have originally thought of the idea of enslaving the humans. The Architect wrote the first Matrix, which was a failure..."entire crops were lost". The Oracle was the one who realized that if you introduced "choice", then the Matrix Program could work and be accepted by the human minds. Obviously there is some relationship between the Oracle and the Merovincian. I have not played the Enter the Matrix Video Game, and have only seen "Reloaded" 5 times, so I'm not sure what it is. I would need more time to pondor the exactitudes.

To learn more:

21stcenturyradio.com...


I would argue that Neo and the Merovingian are connected somehow, but not becuase the Merovingian was a former One. I think the Merovingian serves as a contrast to Neo. The proper literary term is a "foil". This makes sence to me. If you accept Neo as Christ/Budha figure, the Merovincian could be symbolic of Satan. There is a lot a scholorly efforts that seem to draw the conclusion that Christ and Satan were brothers. Satan/Lucifer was a fallan angel, who was regected by the Supreme Lord (Jahway, Jehojah, The Lord, etc). I like this dicotomy, Merovingian as the Enslaver, Neo as the Liberator. This could explain why the Merovingian seems to be in exile in the Matrix also.

In all honesty, I don't know. But some things to consider.

Regards,
E


At last someone who sees that it is a much bigger picture and recognises the connections go beyond any isolated group or cabal. ALL institutions of power are and have always been controlled by an elite since history began. The Merovingians are suppossedly descended from the first King of Atlantis, King Merovee. (who was a supposed sea serpent/demon/reptillian/Anunaki etc..) Did you know that Prince William (the future heir to the throne of England) is considered the first British royal to be a complete Merovingian? The marrige of Prince Charles and Diana Spencer was the first time the Stuart/Spencer Line (Diana's) and the Hanover/Tudor Line (Charles) has bread for centuries, both are considered to be of Merovingian descent. Thus re-enforcing the bloodline, also it has been considered that when Prince William is made King he should use his second name and become King Arthur II.
How the hell does this relate to the topic? Well the legends of King Arthur's return are the mirror of the prophecy's of the return of the Anti-Christ. King Arthur "the once and future king". The Anti-Christ "the king that once was and shall be again". Appparently according to Revalations Jesus will return after the Anti-Christ has returned pretending to be Jesus 2. It seems clear that Jesus/Anti Christ are similar in their return but one will be good the other bad(but only after pretending to be good for a while). So if Neo is the second coming, who is the Anti-Christ? Smith or The Merovingian?

Where is my spoon?
Videogame Freak Mak

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strife wrote:

The Merovingian's were an old French dynasty who had claimed they decended from the line of Jesus Christ after his resurrection and apparent life with Mary Magdaline (sp?). Being a Christian and knowing that Jesus didn't shack it up and went up to heaven after 40 days, I just want to clairify that this is _not_ a view shared by Christians. Anyhow, with that out of the way...

If the Merovingian is essentially a "decendant" from Jesus, well, first of all, who is our Jesus figure in the movie? The One. Not necessarily Neo, but any of the previous One's would have been as well. This explaination, like most Matrix explainations, requires one to understand several things.

The One code is attached to a person. That code is then sent back into the source and the Matrix is recompiled and run again. If you're at all familiar with linux administration or just linux at all, you'll know that when you skrew around with the source, you gotta go recompile it. Then you run it again and bam! The changes are applied, everything is good. Therefore, if the one is put into the source, it might make sense that the code he carries is added to the source and, once again, the One is given a choice. Be deleted or live in the Matrix. The person carrying the code does not necessarily have to be destroyed. He's more of a vessal for that code to get added in again.

If you understand that, based on numerous statements the Merovingian and Persephone makes, it is quite likely the Merovingian was a previous One. There's the account that Persephone used to have a relationship with Merovingain very similar to Trinity's with Neo's. Additionally, further evidence to support this requires understanding several other layers of information:

1. That the One and Trinity program have a child

This would give meaning to the sex scene, which no one can really explain up until this point. In Enter the Matrix, the Oracle explains that the Merovingian sold the Oracles visual code to save their son, who is very important and will save the world. Who is this? Very likely Neo. The one hole in this theory, as with most regarding the Merovigian being a previous One, is that he states he survived Neo's predicessors. If he's just been put back into the Matrix pot and seen other One's go flying by that would explain it, although it does seem like a cheap answer to a movie which doesn't offer any cheap answers.

2. That their child is the next One

Who knows why, the why we cannot understand until Revolutions is out. But once again, that sex scene is irrelevant from what we know and understand right now. I strongly believe that such a long, drawn out part of the movie holds very important significance.

Ok, that all being said, Merovingian, based on the importance the Wachowskis put on each name, is likely a previous one.


Neo and Trinity having a child is possible I guess, but the child wouldn't be of very much importance, because the child wouldn't have metal plugs and therefor would be unable to enter the matrix.

It would be interesting if the Merovingian and Neo had a connection, but the Merovingian is a program and Neo is human*knows that I'm about to be bombarded with "Neo is a program" crap* Trinity is also human. Maybe the Merovingian was a human but the machines thought he'd have further use, so they copied his brain wave patterns onto a program, but that's a stretch.

The Matrix Bunch! With who the hell knows as the Oracle

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