»God in the matrix?«

What I have found is that the matrix movie is in fact saying that there is no god.

Because if you look at it this way you might see what I mean.

Jesus obviously was someone who was in the matrix world. That is why the characters in the matrix say JESUS and goddamn..

But if jesus was really real wouldnt he have saved the human race from the matrix?

The reason why the characters blaspheme is because they feel that there is no god.

The real savior is neo

How do you mean, 'If Jeseus Was real...saved the human race'?.

If im reading correctly, then you must remember that the Movies is set in 2199 or whatever. The time of Jesus had already passed thousands of years before, along with the rest of history.

Also remember that many have managed to relate the matrix to the bible, in that Neo is indeed the saviour - a reflection of the occurances in the bible.

The reson the characters use blaspheme , i believe is the same reason we all do. We all swear, not for any deep reason.

"Thus I redesigned it, based on your history..."

Did people in 1999 really say those things? Hmm. Whattaya say?

THE_FIRST_ONE wrote:

What I have found is that the matrix movie is in fact saying that there is no god. Because if you look at it this way you might see what I mean. Jesus obviously was someone who was in the matrix world. That is why the characters in the matrix say JESUS and goddamn.. But if jesus was really real wouldnt he have saved the human race from the matrix? The reason why the characters blaspheme is because they feel that there is no god. The real savior is neo

THE_FIRST_ONE:But if jesus was really real wouldnt he have saved the human race from the matrix?

Neo scarified him self to the Machine world to save Zion.
There are people that can NOT function in the real world with out religion so they must remain plugged into the matrix.

Jesus was real 2006 years later he had made a big impact on the world.

Jesus spoke against the rich and powerfull.
Jesus helped the poor.
He was a great Prophet.
But he was no God.

as for blaspheme
Look at the Movie "Pulp Fiction" the director is refering to the Holy Bible as Fiction.

ok now look at it this way.. when neo ahd gottin transformed my Agent Smith the machines killed him/smith. adn in the move when theu switch to what neo would have seen right as all the smiths had "blown up" there was a giant flash the resebled the cross adn then when the machine dragged neo off he hasd his arms spread out.. now do you think theres a connection?

Form that perspective the only way for the movie, The Matrix, to not say that would be for the movie to not exist.

Is that your preference?

Maybe Jesus should have kept the movie from being made.

bring the whole thing to real - read the bible

christ did come to free us from the matrix curse of death
He was murdered and rose from the dead to prove He has power over the curse
He did , in His name, give believers the same power over the works of the devil relative to their faith in Him
He said He would save all who called on Him and come to them and reside as the Holy Spirit as the comfortor within and help us through this battle the enemy had begun in the garden of eden for our minds and souls
That is why He said:
He said you must be born again to counter the ancestral curse and your lifetime of programming from the god of this world-the devil who only comes to lie and murder and steal
good luck and look out for the phoney cults who deviate from what the Book has written and will attempt to enslave you even further
p31

NO! im not saying that at all. Just go watch that part and then lets see who's "right" in a sence. Because all im saying is that Neo IS the god in the matrix.

Well , the biblical parrallels are pretty close- i think mainly because the biblical message IS the most important message for this fallen world, that only through one sinless human Christ, who fought the devil of this world and allowed Himself to be murdered to achieve freedom from the death curse for all on the planet past . present and future - the only provisio is that it must be accepted by individuals freely - God does not want a bunch of robots for eternal companions
so the matrix tackles the sin problem and loss of fellowship with the creator-i think they lost the thread in sequals
p31

quote="Dark Neo666"]NO! im not saying that at all. Just go watch that part and then lets see who's "right" in a sence. Because all im saying is that Neo IS the god in the matrix.[/quote]

I'm thinkin' your "jesus" con-coction has absolutely no resemblance to anything Matrix... as in "matrix" is closer to the truth.. and yer goddamned jesus stuff is just a product of an ancient scifi writer, a couple thou yars ugo..

..Never was a god... God is just a complex creation by scifi authors of a couple thousand years ago, implemented as a synthetic imaginary surrogate father authority figure, in an attempt to quell the rogue antics of the out of control, parentless teens of the times, to try to suppress their incessant violence, stealing, and multiplying.. same as the legal system caters to them today, by caging us all in their zoo...

Some may believe that there is a god, but that's just a ridiculous pipedream, which the mindless absolutely need.. because they haven't got a prayer in hell... Mostly because their religions don't have the first clue about effecting an immortality continuation...

God was invented to make peace where there was none... Now America is using god to make war where there was none... The Spaniards decimated the ancient tribes of the Inca, Aztecs, Mayan, Heida, Polynesian, and others.. in the name of god and king, to rob their gold, and play sex and murder games with their little daughters... Same thing as America is doing to Arabia...
Claims of the existence of a "God".. Give us a goddamn break from your mass-insanity!...

Now in Matrix technology, we have humans being powerful and "magic".. the way it should be in a reality...
The irony of it is that Matrix is more real than what this mindless culture believes in...

_________________


Watchout! I'm Dangerous...

FUCK

Never noticed this thread before ...

True theism is something which was dropped in M2/M3 and yet hinted at so wonderfully in M1.

In M1 we are not told that the Oracle is a program. If she is taken as she is introduced, as a person living in the Matrix who has the ability to tell the future and speak to God (as the name Oracle suggests), then a new layer is added to the story (a layer that existed for me for several years until the sequels squelched it).

The Oracle as a person, and the idea that Neo is only the second One, the returning king, adds a lot of theism into the piece.

Because it means that the events in the real world have significance, that what the characters do matters, and that ultimately behind it all, there is a true supernatural force at work ...

The sequels sucked that right out and left us a Zion with no God, which is one of the reasons I think people wanted to then reject that Zion, it had devolved into another machine run Matrix.

cosmicbrat wrote:

I'm thinkin' your "jesus" con-coction has absolutely no resemblance to anything Matrix... as in "matrix" is closer to the truth.. and yer goddamned jesus stuff is just a product of an ancient scifi writer, a couple thou yars ugo.. ..Never was a god... God is just a complex creation by scifi authors of a couple thousand years ago, implemented as a synthetic imaginary surrogate father authority figure, in an attempt to quell the rogue antics of the out of control, parentless teens of the times, to try to suppress their incessant violence, stealing, and multiplying.. same as the legal system caters to them today, by caging us all in their zoo... Some may believe that there is a god, but that's just a ridiculous pipedream, which the mindless absolutely need.. because they haven't got a prayer in hell... Mostly because their religions don't have the first clue about effecting an immortality continuation... God was invented to make peace where there was none... Now America is using god to make war where there was none... The Spaniards decimated the ancient tribes of the Inca, Aztecs, Mayan, Heida, Polynesian, and others.. in the name of god and king, to rob their gold, and play sex and murder games with their little daughters... Same thing as America is doing to Arabia... Claims of the existence of a "God".. Give us a goddamn break from your mass-insanity!... Now in Matrix technology, we have humans being powerful and "magic".. the way it should be in a reality... The irony of it is that Matrix is more real than what this mindless culture believes in... _________________ Watchout! I'm Dangerous...

Really? You think God was invent a couple thousand years ago?

I don't see how you think that the Jesus imagry has no resemblance the the matrix. Before Neo fights Seraph (which would be short for Seraphiem (sp?) which is a bibical angel name. Hence: Wingless) they show a picture of jesus and some hindu images. There's more but come on, I don't have that much break time.

I don't buy mindless rants about things even if there are partial truths.

If you dont see messianic imagry in the movies, you're blind. But still entitled to your opinion.

Cheers

Morpheus believed that Neo was the One his savior the one that would end the killing.

The Number One is a number assigned to God.
When they say Neo is the One they are saying that Neo is God.

When Neo got out of the elevator in Zion the people saw Neo as their Savior.

A God has superpowers.
A God is faster than a speeding bullet.
A God can Fly.
Neo is a God.

DaVinci wrote:

A God has superpowers. A God is faster than a speeding bullet. A God can Fly. Neo is a God.

Thus Superman is a God?


just kidding

Aquin wrote:

DaVinci wrote: A God has superpowers. A God is faster than a speeding bullet. A God can Fly. Neo is a God. Thus Superman is a God? just kidding

Yes Superman is a God
Superman is Jesus

THE_FIRST_ONE wrote:

What I have found is that the matrix movie is in fact saying that there is no god. Because if you look at it this way you might see what I mean. Jesus obviously was someone who was in the matrix world. That is why the characters in the matrix say JESUS and goddamn.. But if jesus was really real wouldnt he have saved the human race from the matrix? The reason why the characters blaspheme is because they feel that there is no god. The real savior is neo

Ok,
The matrix was based on the world as it was in otherwords our world as it exists now. There are churches and people belive in god. Therefore this has been passed down into the matrix.

THE_FIRST_ONE wrote:

What I have found is that the matrix movie is in fact saying that there is no god. Because if you look at it this way you might see what I mean. Jesus obviously was someone who was in the matrix world. That is why the characters in the matrix say JESUS and goddamn.. But if jesus was really real wouldnt he have saved the human race from the matrix? The reason why the characters blaspheme is because they feel that there is no god. The real savior is neo

There is a God, God is in us all: that's why we all have responsibility and a purpose to fulfill.

The Source and the Matrix are perfect symbolisations of this situation.

And Jezus would not save us from "operation Dark Sky", because we do this out of free will. It's humanity's own dumb decision to scorch the sky, so Jezus is not going to make his hands dirty on that.

If god is in us all, then why should anyone interfere with either free will or its results, which are based on causality? Indeed, why would anyone want to interfere, regardless?

intell wrote:

If god is in us all, then why should anyone interfere with either free will or its results, which are based on causality? Indeed, why would anyone want to interfere, regardless?

Your question lacks a statement. If God were not in us all (of course, I don't think he is either, I think we all are God but that's a whole other discussion), then why should anyone interfere with either free will or its results, which are based on causality?

CaptPostMod wrote:

intell wrote: If god is in us all, then why should anyone interfere with either free will or its results, which are based on causality? Indeed, why would anyone want to interfere, regardless? Your question lacks a statement. If God were not in us all (of course, I don't think he is either, I think we all are God but that's a whole other discussion), then why should anyone interfere with either free will or its results, which are based on causality?

The question as posed or however you want to alter it, still stands.

Trolling again, Capt. It must be that time of the month again.

intell wrote:

The question as posed or however you want to alter it, still stands.

I'm not attempting to alter it, just trying to clarify. I don't understand the basis for your question, or why it is one that must be asked if there is God in all of us, but does not need to be asked it there is only one God. So my request for clarification still stands.

intell wrote:

Trolling again, Capt. It must be that time of the month again.

You're the troll, intell. I post my thoughts on things or offer points of exploration, sometimes I ask people for clarification (and sometimes I do get hacked off at those who claim to know the answer and I start to look a bit troll like). You, Mr. Troll, all you typically do is harass people about their thoughts and interests without offering much in the way of your own. But you're very good at your trolling, so you generally are accepted as "saying something." But you rarely are.

Quote:

I'm not attempting to alter it, just trying to clarify. I don't understand the basis for your question,...

I can't help but agree with you. You don't understand. Maybe a person should understand a question before answering or rephrasing it -or- maybe a person should recognise that if they can't understand it that they should leave it for those who can. Maybe.

Quote:

why it is one that must be asked if there is God in all of us, but does not need to be asked it there is only one God. So my request for clarification still stands.

How do you reach this conclusion, exactly?

Quote:

You, Mr. Troll, all you typically do is harass people about their thoughts and interests without offering much in the way of your own. But you're very good at your trolling, so you generally are accepted as "saying something." But you rarely are.

Jealous because you rarely are accepted as "saying something"? Try saying something more often.

What I do is question that which is questionable and challenge that which is presented without basis. I'm flattered you recognise that.

All that intell, and you still didn't clarify your question one bit.

Would you like to discuss God in the Matrix, or just flame me more?

It seems there are three major (and one minor) schools of theistic opinion espoused on Matrix-Explained.com.

Monotheism- There is only one God, a supreme sentient being

Panentheism- God is a force that flows through all things and is the ground from which all things spring

Atheism- The universe is and no sentient being nor pervading God force created or influences it.

And then there's the lesser school (which is mostly just me )-

Pantheism- There is no seperation between things. All are a part of one large body which could be called God, the Universe, reality, or illusion.

Which of these do the films best support?

The original film, to me, seems to very much support panentheism and/or monotheism. The miraculous nature of the Oracle, the fateful defeat of Cypher, the resurrection of Neo. They all suggest an active God force in the real world.

M2/M3 seem to shift over to pantheism and/or atheism. Pantheism because machines and humans are shown to be very relient on each other. There is quite a bit of discussion about the interconnected relation of things.

Atheism and pantheism because: The human world is not controlled by an overt faith (no miraculous Cypher defeats), resurrection is only possible in the virtual world (Trinity is brought back in the Matrix, but later dies in the real world), and the Oracle is not miraculous, she's just a good mathematician (a computer program able to process the most likely outcomes for the future in order to influence said future).

I wonder what caused this shift between films? Why remove God and the miraculous from the world of Zion?