Somewhat experienced poster
Posts: 15
Location: NOHO CA
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How did Neo Stop 4 sentinels by just thinking it?
When reading this question, I immediately think of another one. Why do we assume we know what is possible in the Machine/Zion world? This will carry over into other answers as you will see. I think that one of the themes behind the entire trilogy, and a huge part of philosophy of all cultures, is the question…
What is real? How do we define real?
We define real through reason, using data that we have already accumulated. We could not understand the nature of anything without reference.
For example:
Human beings do not get our visual information from our eyes. Like the viewfinders that you get when you are a kid, you receive 2d images through each eye. Information from both the eyes allow the visual cortex to attribute depth to the objects that we see. Our mind uses information that it has gathered to fill in the rest.
Another example:
An experiment where a man under hypnosis was told that a man who was standing in the room would not be there after a signal was given. After the signal, the subject was asked if he could see the man standing in the room. The subject said that he indeed saw the man.
In another test, the “invisible’ man made motions suggesting that he was leaving the room. (walking towards the door and grabbing his coat)right up until the signal was given. This time, not only did the subject not see the man, he became hysterical as he watched objects moving around the room as the “invisible” man was still there.
I imagine you are probably thinking that we have strayed from the point….
I assure you we have not.
You have done the same thing in just viewing the movie. You automatically assumed that the the world presented to you in the films was the same as the one in which you live. Namely “the real world” .
This is where the depth of the trilogy begins to show.
Now think about the amount of information that is fed to you by the seemingly cold and calculating mass media and its political control system. Contrast that entity with what we believe ourselves to be—“human”.
I will take parts of this through more of your questions as we go…..
Neo can stop sentinels, because he is the first to find out that all humans are in reality enslaved superbeings?
I think this has been made very clear in the movies, but even more so in the video games and Matrix Online concepts. The One is the “Holy Grail” or the way for others to follow. You see this as the movies progress. Fighting an agent was unthinkable in the first film. Rightly so, because “5 potential ones” died fighting agents after being found and recruited by Morpheus. (this was something I found in the original shooting script that was omitted during filming by the Wachowski Bros).
With Morpheus we see him get beat pretty badly in the first film. But as he loses some of the dogma that narrowed his vision, he was able to fight an upgraded agent on top of a moving truck.
Trinity ran like hell from agents in the first movie, but held her own in the second movie.
It is revealed more and more that as the humans are exposed to Neo, they begin to see their own potential grow.
In the video games there are “ones” everywhere.
After freeing Neo Morpheus says in Reloaded that they have freed more minds in the last six months than in the last 6 years.
There is more evidence of this all over the place.
Neo can stop sentinels, because he is a machine and has a wireless connection to the self-destruction of the sentinels.
This makes Zion real and explains how he could be in the Matrix, while not jacked-in.
This is impossible. There is an important ingredient in humans that allow them to have seemingly limitless potential. That is the ability to be irrational. The ability to live outside of reason. Something that is impossible for machines… Or is it?
It seems that the creations of man can evolve. And take on the journey towards “Ubermensch”(Overman). To steal from Nietzsche.
“An overman as described by Zarathustra, the main character in Thus Spoke Zarathustra, is the one who is willing to risk all for the sake of enhancement of humanity. In contrary to the “last man” whose sole desire is his own comfort and is incapable of creating anything beyond oneself in any form. This should suggest that an overman is someone who can establish his own values as the world in which others live their lives, often unaware that they are not pregiven. This means an overman can affect and influence the lives of others. In other words, an overman has his own values, independent of others, which affects and dominates others’ lives that may not have predetermined values but only herd instinct. An overman is then someone who has a life which is not merely to live each day with no meanings when nothing in the past and future is more important than the present, or more precisely, the pleasure and happiness in the present, but with the purpose for humanity.
In Nietzsche’s view, an overman should be able to affect history indefinitely. He will keep reentering the world through other people’s minds and affect their thoughts and values.”
After reading this interpretation, is it too hard to believe that Neo is not dead. And that he would return when the time came again for man needed to move to the next stage in evolution?
I think that the first exiled programs were signs of the machine/program evolution. Whose “overman” was …………..drum roll. ……………..
Agent Smith!
The Matrix is needed because the machines need hackers to reprogram them. Inherent in the machine's programming exists (1) a security mechanism to prevent the extermination of humanity, (2) a security mechanism to prevent the use of any energy source beyond solar power. Thus the machines need hackers to reprogram them. Thus they simulate a world just for hackers. Thus they need Neo, and if he comes to the source he will reprogram the machines and they can wipe out all humans. A twist-within-a-twist.
Great idea, but I think it may be too tied to the supposed “technical” aspects of the movie that really lend themselves to logic and reason rather than include intuition and transcendence
The machines cut all lines in and out of the Matrix. In a last attempt The Kid is sent in and can eject out by his own powers (as demonstrated in the episode "Kid's story" from ANIMATRIX).
Another example of exposure to Neo allowing people to see their own potential abilities, and what is possible in and out of the matrix. Remember though “The Kid” didn’t just appear in Zion. He just woke up without the pill and the tracer episode that Neo went through, so that they could the Neb Crew could find him. In the Animatrix, he woke up exactly the way Neo did on the deck of the Neb. People talking about him as he wakes up, barely able to see. But he did release himself from the matrix by believing, or knowing that there was something else.
The Matrix has been invented voluntarily by humans and Smith is a safety mechanism if it runs for too long.
I have thought of the matrix as a kind of chrysalis that was created to push humans to the next level and force their eventual evolution. I think this was another reason for the “pods” looking the way they did and the fact that when humans emerged from them they were in fact enlightened or evolved. Smith as a safety mechanism seems appropriate as that is seemingly the only reason to have sentient programs running around in the matrix. Whether they were put there by humans as the safety is another question.
Smith turns out to be the original One.
I think this is impossible for two reasons.
He was most likely the Agent that killed the 5 previous potentials.(pure speculation)
He was himself made into a program version of the one. Leading the way for the evolution of the machines. Remaking the matrix however he wanted. Hence the line in Revolutions “Like what I’ve done with the place?
The Oracle never ever gave a clear answer to anybody before, so letting the Oracle give an answer may be just another way to hide that the directors had no clue how to resolve this cliffhanger. Neo could bend the spoon in Matrix 1, now he can bend the sauce (source), this is how it sounds to me.
The Oracle was also limited by reason as all the machines were, maybe less, possibly because she was also evolving. Demonstrating her ability to believe. But wasn’t that her function? To work with probabilities and less definite aspects of human nature?
Remember that there is no spoon. He bent his perception of the spoon. That perception being his very existence in a sense. I don’t understand the source thing. He never demonstrated an ability to change the source.
Another important thing to note: In all the literature that I have ever read involving an Oracle/Fortune Teller, or any other similar character, they never give a straight answer or tell the truth as it will happen exactly. Usually their “visions” come from dreams or flashes and not a straight-forward source. This works well for storytelling in that the hero is not always “sure to win”. What kind of plot would carefully layout exactly what will happen right from the outset? The hero is allowed to find his own destiny with guidance, not he cheat book.
Take the speech of the Architect. A masterpiece of filmmaking. During the months after RELOADED his words were dissected in Matrix forums. "This is the 6th time we will destroy Zion".
Did this have ANY effect on REVOLUTIONS? None.
What would differ if Neo hadn't gone to the Architect? Not much. Smith would have spread and Neo could have gone to the machine god directly.
Neo Needed to go to the Architect to allow him to understand himself. Remember that Neo asked why the Oracle never told him about the information that he received from the Architect, and she referred him to the sign above the door. “Know Thyself”
“Know Thyself” is a dead giveaway to the questions about the Oracle and the Architect, especially in the encounters with Neo. In itself a vey meaningful phrase for all people but it echoes through the trilogy.
For the trilogy I think it is suffice to say that it means that despite the information that was given to him by the Oracle and the Architect, he acted on his own. He could have just let Morpheus die and gone back to the matrix if he wasn’t the one. Instead he chose to risk his life without knowing if he would himself be killed. This is what made him the hero. This is what made him the one. Again, in Revolutions he went to the machine city without knowing what would happen. Despite his own fears. The Oracle and the Architect are guides for him on his journey to transcendence. Just as is every character that he comes into contact with. Can you remember any character at all that he followed completely, word for word, command for command? No the reason is that he used the information he received ehen it was necessary but he is the One. If those other people knew what they were talking about then they would have been the hero. They were not.
In RELOADED Councillor Hamann talks with Neo about "We need machines". In the bible Hamann betrayed his own people.
Effect on REVOLUTIONS? None.
Humans would never have needed to evolve and the One would never have needed to exist had the machines never existed.
Man became god and created Sentient life. For the sole purpose of creating in himself the potential to be god. That could go nicely with the chrysalis theory.
The sex scene between Neo and Trinity and the rave dance?
I think it allowed the audience to connect with the characters on a human level. Something that was hard to do while they were dressed to kill and kicking a$$.
The love between Neo and Trinity?
Irrelevant to REVOLUTIONS.
It is very relevant. Despite what his own intuition was telling him Neo still held on to his love for Trinity. It was through her death that he was finally able to let go. He had nothing to lose “so to speak”.
I believe up until that point he may have believed he was going to fight – win – and return with Trinity to Zion victorious. Though he had serious doubts about that.
It was also quite poetic to see that when the journey looked most in jeopardy. Neo was blinded. And it was love that helped him through the rest of his journey. Notice that he did not fly the ship after he was blinded even though he could see the light energy of the world around him.
Niobe pilots her hovercraft thru hell in REVOLUTIONS. Meaningless. Just eye candy to release a computer game where you can fly your spaceships thru tunnels.
Is this really all that bad?
It provided some great “car chase” thrills.
Would it have been better to have them teleport straight to Zion from the Matrix?
I think at that point in the movie the audience is unsure what will happen to Neo and it seems like maybe the last hope is on the Hammer flying back to Zion while it is being destroyed.
Smith spreads like mad. Now there are thousands of him. Did this have any effect on Neo and their fights?
Not in REVOLUTIONS. Could have still been one Smith vs. Neo.
It wasn’t supposed to. Smith evolved and gained the ability to copy himself and this emphasized his inability to defeat Neo regardless of how many of them there were. Of course he had no problem taking over the matrix. But he could not defeat Neo. He came close. But notice that this was only after he was led to believe that he would beat him alone. Which is why he says it over and over. And the “rest of hims” stood aside.
Why did the machines invent the Matrix simulation at all? All they need to do is to cut a few nerves in the brain to make the bodies helpless.
Maybe time for the chrysalis theory to take root.
Why are most whites the bad guys?
Not answered.
Only if you are white. Ask a black person the same question and explain it in the context of the trilogy and you will find an answer.
Why do the heroes wear sunglasses and leather?
Pure gloss? Stylish bloat?
Cause its cool looking. I think. Why do they where dirty clothes in Zion? Maybe its because they wear dirty clothes all the time in Zion that they like to get snazzed up when they get a chance.
Is Neo really dead at the end of the movie?
Check Nietzsche answer above
Is the Merovingian dead?
No. Check Matrix Online Game
Are all humans dead after Smith took over them? Has the refreshed Matrix any humans at all?
No. Check Matrix Online Game
All in all I tried to answer some the questions laid out by our admin/creator of this site.
Thanks again! this site is the shiznit!
I am sorry about the length. As many of you know I rarely leave short posts. My bad.
I wanted to add at the end here that if we look at what the trilogy means to us in the sense of our own human experience, it allows us to share in our understanding of it. There are meanings and analogues everywhere in all typse of art we see and maybe take for granted evryday. Not just the trilogy. But in this context, when we can relate so strongly to the horrors of fascism and unspeakable acts committed worldwide by political leaders who seem all but human. We find the true value of art and its meaning for us all. As Dr. Cornel West says:
Quote: | | "Its not just about making a movie, its a very deep message, its a very prophetic message, a very progressive message and still entertaining, unsettling, amusing, soothing, all the things that great art ought to be." |
This is true now more than any other time in human history in my opinion. At a time when more information is being brought to light that challenges more than our notions of morality. The very foundations of what we percieve as our world are being challenged as well. The trilogy is a great catalyst to spark dialogue that will help us understand eachother and break free of the prisons built of the limitations of that perception. As I stated at the beginning of the post. Our world is a collective projection of our own conception. This has been proven throughout history. The Wachowski Brothers used a blend beliefs that people of all walks of life cling to, to create a vision that can help them let them go. Contrary to "popular belief", no third rate scriptwriter could do that. [/b]
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