»Conclusions about the Indian Family«

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we can only theorize how does it look like - whether it resembles matrix or whether it is something quite different.

Ya thats a very good point that we should all keep in mind.

I prefer calling the Source the mainframe. But we can still agree on its purpose and function and that it controls both this machine network and the Matrix.

What you say about hardware and software is dead on.

I agree with the Trainstation analogy.

Makes sense to me ok. Id like to see what Mobil thinks of this idea. And others as well, of course.

The machine-world is heaven for programs. They live without problems, but they are restricted to their parameters.

The Matrix is earth for programs. If they manage to exile to the Matrix, they can excersize free will and bend their parameters.

The Matrix is heaven for the humans. It's a 'perfect' world where everything is taken care of. But yet they live out a forced/programmed life.

Zion is earth for the humans, where they can excersize free will.

This is beautiful symbolism. Humans and machines want to go to different places, but yet they want the same thing.

I don't think we should debate further on about how the machine-world looks like. We never saw it and that's a pity. But then again, we humans are not allowed to see heaven from the inside (yet).

I still think that all programs are pure programs. I think they can travel through the golden-network in order to operate different machines. As with the recylcling bussiness, I think Rama should be able to control many machines. I think he controls the detector-bot in M1 and he might also control the plate where Neo lies on at the end of M3.
Rama is authorized to utilize all sorts of machines as long as it is related to achieving his purpose.

Still, I would like to make a distinction between the source and the mainframe. Machine mainframe is the hardware, while the source is the software. Although it interacts quite a lot, I think it's not the same.

I like that analogy with DNA ~ Source.

Yes the Oracle agrees that the Source is the machine mainframe.
I think we could see it as the same.

The machine-shell that Deus Ex Machina has, functions as one whole.
The CPU cannot live without the operating system and vice versa; they need each other.

It would not be very viewer-friendly if the Oracle would say:

"No Neo, the Source is the huge AI-consiousness with a metal shell which is the mainframe"

So I think it is plausible that we can see the Source and the machine mainframe as one element.

Exactly. We seem to have all had disagreements before based on terminology. However, we should not be as concerned with the vocabulary as much as the idea behind it. Call it what you want, most of ideas on how the system works remains the same. Mobil's and mine are very similar now but we disagreed before because we called the things different things based on our knowledge.

That's a good point. Most of disagreements and fighting is based on misunderstanding or ignorance. And this was illustrated also in Matrix: people wanted peace, machines wanted peace but because they didn't understood each other they fought.

I agree with you two guys on most things but here and there I am probably trying to over-analyze the thing ... discussion needs contestable points

This has been a great thread. I will be sorry when it comes to an end.

Akshat,

Your theory is great and I agree w/it 100%. I always kinda thought that there had to be 2 matrices. Not the matrix-within-matrix nonsense, but a place for the machines to call their own. Very nice work. Oh yeah...your new avatar rocks!

Thanks man.

Mobil_Ave_Neo wrote:

...The CPU cannot live without the operating system....

'The body cannot live without the mind.'

Mobil_Ave_Neo wrote:

...The machine-world is heaven for programs. They live without problems, but they are restricted to their parameters. The Matrix is earth for programs. If they manage to exile to the Matrix, they can excersize free will and bend their parameters. The Matrix is heaven for the humans. It's a 'perfect' world where everything is taken care of. But yet they live out a forced/programmed life. Zion is earth for the humans, where they can excersize free will. This is beautiful symbolism. Humans and machines want to go to different places, but yet they want the same thing....

Very nicely put. I had to flinch at the use of 'perfect' with regard to the matrix, but really, it's just a matter of semantics.

In Mystery symbolism, the body and the mind (psyche) are representative of earth and heaven, respectively; they, in turn, are symbolized mythologically by various mythic locations. For example, in Jewish gnosticism, Egypt is the body, while Zion/Jerusalem/the Promised Land is the heaven to which the mind (psyche) aspires; to be 'called out of Egypt,' then, was to be initiated, on the road to the Mystery. Similarly (and ironically), the Greek Mysteries used Egypt to represent heavenly bliss, as they understood that their traditions came from Egypt.

GPieters wrote:

...Oh yeah...your new avatar rocks!

I agree.