»why neo has powers in the "real world"?«

why neo has powers in the real world, there is another matrix that includes both?

nati wrote:

why neo has powers in the real world, there is another matrix that includes both?

Oh hell ~ not again..!

yah, knnknn, this thread needs to go...

may be he is not 100% human!
may be he is not in real word
may be... may be... may be.....
may be he is an X-Men! :-)

@Nati

You certainly have noticed from the responses, how controversial this subject is, and from the "script" point of view, the viewer is not meant to understand the reason behind this sequence, which seems to be a crucial key point revealed in the third installment.

You may not believe haw many theories were spawned by this sequence, how many hours spent solving this puzzle, all remain but speculations.

I recommend taking a closer look at this great site:

matrix-explained.com...

Also an ineresting viewpoint..........(Don`t forget : All Speculation)
us.imdb.com...

To get you even more confused, the quote below from the Enter The Matrix game dialogues between the Oracle and Niobe, -not considering the double meanings and the nature of the Matrix- is the among the most relevant explanation -if you could draw one!!!!-

Quote:

Niobe : Then Neo is alive? Oracle : Yes. He touched the Source and separated his mind from his body. Now he lies trapped in a place between your world and ours. Niobe : Can we free him? Oracle : Trinity can. But she will have to fight her way through hell to do it.

So good link! So good viewpoint

Nati, what we mean is that this has been done to death...NEXT...!!!!!

Another Smith wrote:

Nati, what we mean is that this has been done to death...NEXT...!!!!!

They are deja-vus. Just glitches. Nothing to worry about.

emp wrote:

Another Smith wrote: Nati, what we mean is that this has been done to death...NEXT...!!!!! They are deja-vus. Just glitches. Nothing to worry about.

PHEW...

@mgt

Este Tono de mofa no te vas. Parece que estás tan casado de todas las especulaciones, pero...........

Por lo menos, vos sabes la realidad, Neo es un X-man.......

atreides wrote:

@mgt Este Tono de mofa no te vas. Parece que estás tan casado de todas las especulaciones, pero........... Por lo menos, vos sabes la realidad, Neo es un X-man.......

Atreides ~ what are you saying my friend?
Please translate...I wait for your reply...

Let's put down two kinds of scenarios; one being the famous matrix-within-the-matrix theory, and the other being the one with the existence of only one matrix.
Let's start off with the second one. Concidering that we already know that as the population of the matrix-virtual-world gets bigger and bigger, the probabilities of an anomaly to emerge gets bigger. We know that upon all test subjects, aprox. 99% accepts the program, and only 1% refuses it; 0.0001% of the 100% is the anomaly, or the One. Well, then we come to the idea of it being neccesary to reload the matrix in order to stop the probabbilities to get bigger(as well as stoping the inevitability of the creation of AI inside of the matrix, which can't happen , otherwise there would be too many anomalies to control in too many matrix, infinite matrix), as well as to control that one anomaly and with its code reboot the matrix itself. We also know that all rebelds are "hidding" in Zion, and that they could be concidered as the 1% of all test subjects which don't accept the matrix(Neo is the 0.000001%; the anomaly), so in other words, all of Zion's population are the 1% which refuse the matrix, so we come to the idea of it being neccesay to destroy Zion in order to destroy all freed minds. That's where the Architect and the Oracle gain importance into this matter. As the Matrix cicle beggins,(for all of you who don't know, it starts on the year 1980 and ends on 2009) we know that Zion is rebuilt by every predocessor(the One) chosing 23 people from the matrix,(not from Zion) to this we sum the One and the Ocacle, which all form the resistance. Corcordantly, Zion's population grows each day, freeing more and more minds to join the resistance, and to keep them with hope and purpose, when the One dies, the Oracle foretells the prophesy to the rebelds, saying that the One would eventually come back again, this is THE purpose for the rebelds to go on, to carry on. And eventually the anomaly does show up, here is when the Oracle has to find it, control it, to guide it to his path, the one which finishes with the Architect in the source. He is supposed to choose the right door, which leads to the salvation of Zion, and the reboot of the matrix, and eventually the death of the One in some time on. This cicle, as we know, has happened 5 past times already, and Neo's is the sixth.
My point here is that, if the machines have to dig to find Zion, destroy it everytime to eliminate and control the freed minds(or humans wich don't accept the matrix), in order to then reaload the matrix and start the cicle again.....then wouldn't it be too much work for them to do this everytime?

It is here where we pass to the second scenario, the one of the matrix-within-the-matrix theory. Let's call the first known matrix as the Alpha matrix, and the "real world" as the Beta matrix. As I see it, it would be a much easier work for the machines to make the "real world" another matrix, another control, this way, the actual machines don't have to dig that much to find and destroy Zion, the only one's who would be doing this would be actual PROGRAMS inside of the "real world", inside the Beta matrix, therefore making it alltogether antoher way of control, to keep those "freed minds" in a measure of control, those minds, as they have already waken up, it's ilogical for them to don't accept the "real world" as they see, becacuse it would be as to wake up from a dream and then wake up again from the "reality".

Now, aside from this, I support my theory with two mayor basis:
1) Neo stopping the sentinels outside of the matrix, there are two possible explanations for this:

a) There is a matrix outside of the matrix, therefore, if he in fact has control over the machines in that way, he has control of the area's laws, making it possible for it to be another matrix, another prison for the mind.
b) Neo's mind is separated from his body after the conversation with the Architect his mind stayed in the source, thus when he actualy stopped the sentinels, he in fact disconected them from the source: I'm not on favor of this theory becuase I believe the body can not live without the mind.


2) Smith getting out of the matrix by Banes' body has 2 possible explanations:
a) The only possible explanation for Smith getting out of the matrix via the phone,it is that in fact the "real world" is another matrix, another system in which in this case Smith(the program) can travell to, as this two systems are connected and he can download himself into Bane's mind(this does have a basis of HOW it(smith) downloads himself to Bane's mind).
b) When a mind like Bane's, which can jack in and jack out of the matrix via his hole in the back of his neck(freed mind), then he/she can have a connection with the system of the matrix, thus making it possible for a program as Smith (virus, or "freed" program)to "download" itself to someone'e mind outside of the matrix(it has no basis on HOW it download's itself). I rather think this theory is nearly not possible.

Now, many questions arise from this theory, which can contradict it, but they have their own arguments and possible answers;

" Why not pull the plugs instead of sending sentinels?" In final terms, becuase they(the machines) need to find the anomaly, and it is escencial to reload the matrix, the anomaly needs to be controled.Another question arises from this fact; "Why not pull the plugs of the anomaly once found?" Becuase they NEED IT to reload the matrix. If they don't send the sentinels, what do you think would happen next? Many things would inevitably happen:

a) The rebelds would have all of their time to free every mind on the matrix, one by one. Now if in fact there is a matrix outside of the known matrix, why not pull the plugs to eliminate the rebelds an the One? Because they need to reload the matrix with the ONE'S PRIME CODE(I will talk about this later on*) inside of him, they need to reboot the matrix and start the cicle again.
b) They need to control the anomaly that emerges from the mathemathical error in the matrix, which gets bigger(the probabilites of an anomaly to emerge) as the population of the matrix grows.
c) They also need to reaload the matrix in order to stop the actual creation of AI inside of the matrix, because that would make infinite layers matrix's one inside the other and would bring up too many anomalies to control, would be out of control.
Now, how do they(the machines) get the anomaly to insert his prime code and reload the matrix? By leading him to the source. Why did Neo(in this case) arrived to the source? By going to the Oracle.Why did he go to the Oracle? Because Zion was about to get destroyed, they have limited time in their hands, if not, they would take the time to free everyone's mind one by one; if they hadn't seen the last transmision from the Osiris, and wouldn't be aware of the danger that threatens Zion, they would be taking their time.The Oracle lead them to the Keymaker, the Keymaker lead them to the Source, the source lead Neo to the Architect, the Architect lead Neo to the choice of the two doors. It is the process that NEEDS to be executed in order to RELOAD the matrix and control the minds which reject the matrix(rebelds and the One)

Now this huge process leads us to square one, where it is very possible of both theories to be correct or wrong, it could be a single matrix, or a matrix within a matrix.....
But, which of both of them is easier for the machines to execute?......yes.... you can answer it yourself.....the matrix within the matrix....if the machines make another matrix outside of the know matrix, then the one's who have to dig to find Zion, to do the one after one pain in the ass job, are PROGRAMS......programs inside of a matrix, a system of control.

* I got another theory refering to Neo's importance in the matrix:
I believe that when the Architect stated that he was frustrated by failure when trying to make a stable matrix, he said that maybe he needed a "lesser mind". This makes me think that maybe he NEEDS to use Neo's mind. Let me explain myself; He inserts the PRIME PROGRAM OR CODE of the matrix in him, he uses his mind and the code to "reflect" the reality of the matrix to all the other minds inside the system, thus this way a imperfect mind reflects like a mirror the reality and he serves as a "FILTER" for everyone's perception of the illusion world. If this were to be true, then Neo is UNDOUBTLY NEEDED to RELOAD and "REFLECT" the matrix in an "unperfect"(or less perfect mind) way, thus making it possible for a computer generated world to be stable and going on.

WHAT DO YOU ALL THINK ABOUT THIS AGENT SMITH?
PIUKNEO.

Neo: What are they?

Morpheus: Sentient programs. They can move in and out of any software still hard-wired to their system. That means that anyone we haven't unplugged is potentially an agent. Inside the Matrix, they are everyone and they are no one. We are survived by hiding from them by running from them. But they are the gatekeepers. They are guarding all the doors. They are holding all the keys, which means that sooner or later, someone is going to have to fight them.

Remember sentient programs can feel (smell, see, touch, etc) which are Human notions... Smiths says "It's the Smell... if there's such a thing"
I have a theory when Neo destroyed Smith, they exchanged some properties. Smith may now have almost 'human mind' potential. Remember he did say he was "Compelled to disobey" and Morpheus said: "The reason mosat of us are here; is because of our affitity for disobedience".
Neo can FEEL the Machines, while Smith is cutting his hand not feeling (or atleast not showing) pain.

YOUR THOUGHTS

This theory can actually help either MwM POV or Zion is Real POV.

SMITH, WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT THE THEORY I POSTED?
PIUKNEO.

Andromeda wrote:

This theory can actually help either MwM POV or Zion is Real POV.

No disrespect. Callin` E M P, E M P........

Regards,

Atreides

Anonymous wrote:

SMITH, WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT THE THEORY I POSTED? PIUKNEO.

Your theory is very interesting ~ However I attended a meeting today at UNI and an interesting theory was put forward regarding which characters are Machines (AI), and which characters are Human this was brought up because of the MWM theory. When I can actually get it straight inside my head I will post this idea here tomorrow.
It was very confusing so I shall sit down with good old fashioned pen and paper(if I can remember how to use them!) and work it all out!!!
By the way PIUKNEO why don't you join us - become a member?!
LONG LIVE SMITH

THANX SMITH, COMPLIMENTS ARE ALWAYS WELL RECIEVED.....THANX MAN, ANSWERING TO YOUR GENTLE COMENT,OF COURSE I WOULD LIKE TO BECOME A MEMBER, BUT THERE'S ONLY A PROBLEM, HOW AND, WHAT IS IT....
PIUKNEO.

SMITH?? ARE YOU THERE?? PART OF WHAT DO YOU WANT ME TOO BE?
PIUKNEO.

The explanation I like most is that Zion is itself another Matrix, so basically, people who "live" in Zion merely live in a Matrix that is seperate from the Matrix that is a copy of today's real world. This I find most probable explanation, because of the things that the Architect tells Neo when they meet in Reloaded:
1. He says that it will be the sixth time that the machines would destroy Zion, and that they are becoming exceedingly efficient at it.
2. He says that if Neo fails to insert his code into the mainframe, the whole system will collapse and it will kill everyone plugged into the Matrix. This means that, since the Matrix still exists, other "The One's" have done that in order to save the Matrix and everyone in it.
3. Next he says that Neo would have to choose 23 people who would rebuild Zion (which means that the machines would destroy Zion again and kill everyone there, or re-insert them into the Matrix). Now how would 23 people do that, unless Zion was handed to them complete, without holes leading to it where the machines drilled, in other words re-set to its starting point? If the Zion was real, I think even machines wouldn't want to waste time to bury it again, since it is much simpler to simply reset the program.

Finally, Neo shows this power to disable machines much like an EMP. Why would he be able to do that in reality, and not in the Matrix? And it is too far-fetched to say "because the Matrix is a prison to one's mind".

There are other explanations too, like the one saying there are layers of Matrix', and a new layer is created whenever "The One" appears, thus the new layer becoming the copy of the world of today, and one layer above the last becomes Zion. This is silly, however, because the original Matrix didn't come into existence that way (see The Second Rennaissance I & II).

Anonymous wrote:

SMITH?? ARE YOU THERE?? PART OF WHAT DO YOU WANT ME TOO BE? PIUKNEO.

Join us man, you've posted many times on this site and you are still a guest, why don't you register? LONG LIVE SMITH

YEAHHHHH!!! I LOGGED IN!!!! THANX SMITH, I HAD FORGOTTEN THAT I WAS INDEED REGISTRED, BUT DIDN'T LOG IN (JEJE).
PIUKNEO.

Ok Smith let's talk in lenght.....let's talk about the MWM theory, what's your thoughts about it.....give me your theories and thoughts.
PiukNeo.