»Take a look at our World..«

Have you all noticed how we are sorrounded and choking by the burden of money? Mostly everything you can think of around the world costs money(mostly objects ofcourse, but emotions can also be bought). People have even sealed of territories of nature which they found fair enough to get money from those who would like to make a trip there..

Why cannot people actually go wherever they want to?
If you tend to take a closer look and watch this world, actually everyone is detained here. We ARE slaves of our own system, we do whatever is told, the only thing that differs our reaction to a task is the source of it(who says it). But we do what the sociaty thinks we are born for. We pay taxes, we go to work when we have to, we are taken to hospital if they say its needed etc..

Is this better than a Matrix?

Well, we could say the matrix is the same as I mentioned, but it also has a higher level of imprisonment.

1. The question is, would you rather live in the Matrix than this world?
(This would eventuate there is a way out of here )

Think of this for a while.. (Unfortunately this won't signify that if you find matrix better has a slight chance you can go there)

Money simply represents resources. We live in a world of limited resources; hence, money.

Mostly everything in the world requires resources to produce --- time, materials, labor, etc. Therefore, it makes sense for mostly everything in the world tp cost money to purchase.

Sagni wrote:

We ARE slaves of our own system, we do whatever is told, the only thing that differs our reaction to a task is the source of it(who says it). But we do what the sociaty thinks we are born for. We pay taxes, we go to work when we have to, we are taken to hospital if they say its needed etc..

Why do you see us as slaves? I guess it depends on how you define slavery. To me, slave does not simply mean, "someone who has to work." Everyone, in both the Matrix and Zion, had to work. Even the programs had to work, else they would face deletion. Everyone has to work because everyone consumes resources, and unless you're lucky enough to have someone else who covers the cost of the resources you consume, then you have to do so.

We pay taxes because the government demands it. But these taxes fund many of the things we take for granted --- the roads down which we drive, the army that keeps us safe from enemy countries, the education which allows us to improve ourselves and make a better life for ourselves. Once again, all these things require resources, and thus we have to pay money for them.

We go to hospitals when we are sick or injured. If you don't want to go to a hospital, you don't have to do so. But believe me, the alternative is usually worse, .

Sagni wrote:

People have even sealed of territories of nature which they found fair enough to get money from those who would like to make a trip there.. Why cannot people actually go wherever they want to?

Elaborate please? To what places are you referring?

Sagni wrote:

1. The question is, would you rather live in the Matrix than this world? (This would eventuate there is a way out of here)

I don't think the people in Zion had life any better than the people in the Matrix. Zion was a fairly bleak place to live. Also, if you don't like being detained, you wouldn't like being in Zion --- one city marked the boundaries of the territory you were allowed to visit. To go any further, you had to get lucky enough to get on the crew of a ship.

Actually I agree with the positive sides also..
Humanity has a nicely established balance.
The reason I wrote my last post, is that I'm not quite sure what am I actually doing in this world. It just feels so distant to me, and mostly I'm not sure this way of life is the right way for us humans.
I think we should help each other, and do a lot of research on our world. We should find out what is the purpose of humanity, why are we here?

At one time, I use to become very depressed about our world, until I looked at it from a more scientific (natralist) point of view.

Instead what I see now is life exuding it's most advanced and complex forms yet. While other forms of life eat things to grow claws on a micro level. We directly extract mettal ore and make it into knives and guns. When I realised this, I no longer thought of cities and building as an absense of life, but as a sign of how well it was doing.

Newer life: Scheming lying, manuvering, and gamepersonship are all signs of new intelegance exerting it's self in very extream ways. War by it's very nature may actually be the most blatant example of life thriving in extream ways.

If you think about it.. it's reflexes, strength, endurance, scheming (tactics), technology, communication, organisation, ideas, societies and even reproduction all put to the most extream sign of their vibrance.

I should also state (just to make sure people don't misunderstand me), that I would greatly prefure an absance of war over the presance of it. I enjoy people being happy over people being sad, but even the fact a form of life can experiance sadness is amazing to me.

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The reason I wrote my last post, is that I'm not quite sure what am I actually doing in this world. It just feels so distant to me, and mostly I'm not sure this way of life is the right way for us humans. I think we should help each other, and do a lot of research on our world. We should find out what is the purpose of humanity, why are we here?

Get involved with life man. It's the best way to make it not feel distant, lonely. Join clubs, try new activities. Unplug. You really feel a lot better when you do so.

Since before even Plato people have been searching for the purpose of humanity. And it has been fruitless. If it brings you happiness searching for such a purpose, go for it. But you must be prepared to face failure --- I can assure you, (there is a very high chance that) you will not find a universal purpose.

The best thing is to try to find your own purpose, or what makes you happy. Maybe your purpose is to have a family, settle down. Maybe it's to travel around the world, always on the move. Maybe it's to be a recluse, pondering the meaning of life. But nobody can tell you what your purpose is. You can only find it for yourself. And you'll know when you find it, because it will feel right.

And usually, you find it when you stop thinking about living, and just live.

Quote:

Morpheus: I can only show you the door. You have to walk through it.

Quote:

Morpheus: Stop trying to hit me and hit me.

Sagni wrote:

Humanity has a nicely established balance.

But you only see it from one viewpoint in which balance is portrayed.

But that old quote about 90% of the wealth in the hands of 5% of the people (or whatever the actual figure was) and the fact that people are starving while nations stockpile food or simply destroy it in order to stimulate demand, suggests otherwise.

I've often wondered, if we'd never got this desire to accumulate wealth, to set profit above benefit, to generally be all around greedy, how much further we would be by now.

Raistath wrote:

At one time, I use to become very depressed about our world, until I looked at it from a more scientific (natralist) point of view. Instead what I see now is life exuding it's most advanced and complex forms yet. While other forms of life eat things to grow claws on a micro level. We directly extract mettal ore and make it into knives and guns. When I realised this, I no longer thought of cities and building as an absense of life, but as a sign of how well it was doing. Newer life: Scheming lying, manuvering, and gamepersonship are all signs of new intelegance exerting it's self in very extream ways. War by it's very nature may actually be the most blatant example of life thriving in extream ways. If you think about it.. it's reflexes, strength, endurance, scheming (tactics), technology, communication, organisation, ideas, societies and even reproduction all put to the most extream sign of their vibrance. I should also state (just to make sure people don't misunderstand me), that I would greatly prefure an absance of war over the presance of it. I enjoy people being happy over people being sad, but even the fact a form of life can experiance sadness is amazing to me.

so you think that humans are just big blobs of chemical reactions that are "thriving" right now?

i think not. i dont think that humans just randomly and abruptly came from no life if an omniscient being didnt send us down here for some reason. i REALLY REALLY dont believe in the "cake theory".

Sagni wrote:

Have you all noticed how we are sorrounded and choking by the burden of money? Mostly everything you can think of around the world costs money(mostly objects ofcourse, but emotions can also be bought). People have even sealed of territories of nature which they found fair enough to get money from those who would like to make a trip there.. Why cannot people actually go wherever they want to? If you tend to take a closer look and watch this world, actually everyone is detained here. We ARE slaves of our own system, we do whatever is told, the only thing that differs our reaction to a task is the source of it(who says it). But we do what the sociaty thinks we are born for. We pay taxes, we go to work when we have to, we are taken to hospital if they say its needed etc.. Is this better than a Matrix? Well, we could say the matrix is the same as I mentioned, but it also has a higher level of imprisonment. 1. The question is, would you rather live in the Matrix than this world? (This would eventuate there is a way out of here ) Think of this for a while.. (Unfortunately this won't signify that if you find matrix better has a slight chance you can go there)

i think that in a way, this world IS a matrix, a swirling blend of lies "to blind you from the truth". thats why i believe in something everlasting, something eternal and more precious than anything else that exists in this matrix world....which is Christ.

Have you ever thinked about our existance? It is so distant, that my mind freezes a little every time I try. I'm just searching for a reason.. Why are we living? And when this is over, and it comes out we are actually souls that learn in this world, or just come here, or I don't know.. Why does the souls do this? What drives us to come here, or just exist?

Frankly, the world is in a bad condition right now, and it does seem as though people are becoming obsessed with 'the system' rather than living. I hope that people are smarter that they appear, but it seems a though people are becoming more complacent and are accepting things even when they are wrong.

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I've often wondered, if we'd never got this desire to accumulate wealth, to set profit above benefit, to generally be all around greedy, how much further we would be by now.

This is a very good point. For example, Microsoft have massive resources and manpower, if they put in some real effort imagine how much they could have acheived... instead they just pump out the same par product over and over, and no-one gets anywhere.

Truthfully, money may be a tool that is nessesary for organisation, but people become to obsessed by it (it does really represent power, which is corrupting) and forget about real life.

Overall, I'm lost. I understand that things are wrong, and it sometimes seems as if I am alone in this; and it seems as though there are some people who do agree but feel the same isolation. Unfortunately, I have no productive advice for you either... lol

Sagni wrote:

Have you ever thinked about our existance? It is so distant, that my mind freezes a little every time I try. I'm just searching for a reason.. Why are we living? And when this is over, and it comes out we are actually souls that learn in this world, or just come here, or I don't know.. Why does the souls do this? What drives us to come here, or just exist?

we came here because god sent us down here to spread the gospel and tell others about the grace of god and the eternal life we can acquire if we just walk through the door he opens for us.

Morpheus:"I can only show you the door. You're the one that has to walk through it."

nocturnal_anonymous wrote:

we came here because god sent us down here to spread the gospel and tell others...

You see this is the part I don't get. Which others?

a) they are not created by God, in which case, where did they come from and what is their purpose, or
b) they were also created by God, but had a different purpose, in which case why are they here? which leads us onto - so how do I know which group I'm in?

Or did I miss a meeting?

I wondered a lot about God, and it's existance.. But what really "bakes my noodles" is it's purpose.. Why does anything exist? Why did he/she create all this? AND if he/she exists in infinite time, what was before this universe, which (as the Bible tells us if I remember correctly) was created aprox. 6000 years ago.

What could drive God?

Why does God think, that if he/she lets a soul exist it is good to that soul?

Why do we have to exist eternaly (in heaven/hell)?

It's like we are doomed to eternity (even if we are reborn again and again)

But don't worry these are just unanswered questions for me about existance,I'm not allways this sceptic.. I believe in something, just like anyone else.

One explanation I got from a member of the God Squad was "God created us to love him".

OK, but if "God IS Love", surely we become redundant under that definition.

I tried reasoning with them - "Stop quoting Bible passages and tell me what YOU beleive" & "Can you answer questions not addressed by the Bible" - but was told I was looking too hard for answers and should "just accept his word", "his word is Truth".

They weren't to happy with me pointing out that my inquisitive nature and desire for answers must also have been created by God, and they left, giving me up as a lost cause.

The phrase "blind faith" sprang to mind.

"When Judgement day comes, I'll be surfing the lake of fire - rockin' out" - Bill Hicks

nocturnal_anonymous wrote:

i think that in a way, this world IS a matrix, a swirling blend of lies "to blind you from the truth". thats why i believe in something everlasting, something eternal and more precious than anything else that exists in this matrix world....which is Christ.

That's ironic. I don't believe in Christianity for the same reason that you do --- I think it's a swirling blend of lies that blind you from the truth.

Tiefling wrote -

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That's ironic. I don't believe in Christianity for the same reason that you do --- I think it's a swirling blend of lies that blind you from the truth.

I couldn't have put this any better myself

its a shame that people subvert the "word of god" for their own ends

in american in the 1800's the owners of land(mostly church patrons and religious figureheads)used the message "work hard and you will get into heaven"

this was purely to line their own pockets than having any relevance to the bible

unfortunately this is being mimicked in a far more terrifying way in the word of islam by certain factions

rathar than to line their own pockets(although osama bin laden is far from poor)they use it to send other to kill innocents because they are simply to cowardly to do it themselves

Absolutely agree with you 100% there Anomaly.

I'm sure the Great Architect of the Universe really does approve of this behaviour.

We need to be enslaved to some degree, otherwise we are in total chaos.. Imagine a worl 'without rules or control'. with no actual person telling you what you can and cannot do. it'd be utter chaos. And as for the rather be under a matrix spell of being forced to live there. Itd be nice to live in the matrix, because if they wanted us to be truly happy, they could make some weird rule that everything is free and it all autospanwns on our front doorstep when we ask it to. But living in the Real world is just uh, too kooky.

Zuul You are absolutely right...

We, as a species can't be trusted to live without rules or controls to some degree - we are free-spirits and not mature enough, spiritually to be left to our own devices.
Our emotions have yet to be mastered too.
However, you only have to take a look at the world and society as a whole to see that those controls are failing.
Change = Chaos.

Change = Chaos. I like that.

We as a species do live without rules or controls. That is, the only rules we obey are those we ourselves create. No higher beings make rules for us (and no, don't say God does, because if there is a God, He hasn't communicated with humans in 2000 years).

The rules and controls that we created have been drummed into us since the dawn of time - almost a second nature.
They have been passed down over the generations.

However, they are failing.. that's my opinion.

Tiefling, self-control is still a type of control.

Also, please refrain from ignorant comments about God. Most people have surely grown out of the ideas of the savage religions which believe their deities can be confined to one place, or can perform certain acts to the exclusion of others.