»Who is that guy lying on the ground?«

After Neo's fight against one of the Smiths, and Neo "loses", the Smiths all fill with light and explode.

Some time later, the Matrix apparently "reboots", there's a scene with a deja-vu cat and Sati lying on the ground.

In between these two events, there's a glimpse of a male figure lying on the ground. He doesn't look like Keanu or Hugo. Neo has been over-written and all the Smiths have exploded (right?) so, who could that be on the ground?

Who is that guy?

Anyone know?

?


hmm...it may be time to re-watch Revolutions.

I can't be the only one who saw him!

It was impossible to see who he was. But I swear there was one guy lying on the ground prior to/during/immediately after (not sure which..) the matrix reboot!

If so, seems kinda important to figure out who he was...

I was under the impression that the body lying down was Neo's body. When someone dies whos jacked in, their body just lies in the Matrix, it doesnt disappear.

That was my idea, but I could be terribly wrong. I couldnt see the body clearly on the version I watched.

Hmmm could be, but Neo's "body" (in the Matrix) was taken over by Smith, right? Your explanation could work, if the following is true: when the final Smith "exploded", he actually just left Neo's Matrix-body, which became Neo again (a dead Neo)...

But I don't know..

Kpucok wrote :

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Hmmm could be, but Neo's "body" (in the Matrix) was taken over by Smith, right? Your explanation could work, if the following is true: when the final Smith "exploded", he actually just left Neo's Matrix-body, which became Neo again (a dead Neo)...

Neo's body was in the Machine City. So it probably was the programme Neo... I've seen it twice & I'm not sure!

1. Neo's *real* body was suspended in a makeshift chair, not lying on the ground (IIRC), so although it's possible, I doubt that's who I'm thinking of

2. Neo's *Matrix* body was taken over by Smith, and we have no good explanation for why it should ever re-appear in the Matrix after that, and after the Smiths are killed

So, I'm still pretty sure I saw some male figure lying on the ground at reboot. And, it could have been Neo, but I couldn't tell, the face/identity appears to be deliberately obscured by the filmmakers to the point where nobody who's responded yet is sure who it was.

Still seems pretty important to figure out who that was.

Ok I seriously can't believe no one else understands this.

Agent Smith took over loads of people including the Oracle, Sati and Seraph - all of which were alive at the end

Therefore after the smiths explode the matrix reorganises, all the people smith took over are lying where their smith-posessed bodies would have been.

make sense?

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make sense?

Sort of.

I understand this much: 1. Smith took over lotsa people/AIs, maybe all (as far as we know). 2. when he "exploded", he left their matrix-bodies, so their matrix-bodies are intact after that (but BEFORE reboot!) 3. We see an example of this with Sati lying on the street, with cat walking by, BEFORE reboot.

Now, we also see Sati "alive" and well *after* the reboot, but that is because she is an AI who has been smuggled by the trainman to the oracle, who protects her such that she survives the reboot. Whether *human* matrix residents would reappear depends on whether people die (in reality) when taken over by the Smith virus; we still don't know the answer to that (do we?). It's possible to guess/form theories either way but there's no positive way of knowing.

Remember that the other "people" who were taken over by Smith but whom we see (*after* reboot) are also AIs: oracle and seraph. The reason they are alive after reboot is because they exist in *every* matrix, they're programs built into it. We have no indication that when Smith died, they reappeared, in the *previous* matrix. (Although it makes sense, since that's what happened to Sati.) But more to the point, their survival into the next matrix tells us very little about what happens to *people* after Smith explodes.

Finally, none of that explains who the guy on the ground was. Are you saying it was Neo?

1. It really, really didn't look like Keanu Reeves. I was looking hard. I could be wrong, is that what you're saying?

2. He was alive. so if it was Neo, he survived the Smith virus, just not the reboot. (Or maybe he survived the reboot as well? This raises all sorts of weird problems.)

kpucok wrote:

I can't be the only one who saw him!

Do you mean the Oracle in the mud?

the oracle? is that who it was?

Explain please... sounds important

I'm presuming they don't mean they oracle because they aren't thick. I am presuming they mean that in the corner of the screen when we see the deja vu cat there is another body. That is someone who has just had Smith cancelled out of them. To say that only programs survived Smiths explosions seem silly to me, but I'll allow myself to be proved wrong. Of course it won't be Neo though cause he'd be in the crater with the oracle and we could clearly see that he wasn't. Only the person who the Smith in the crater had posessed was in the crater. Neo has been spread through the matrix.

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I am presuming they mean that in the corner of the screen when we see the deja vu cat there is another body. That is someone who has just had Smith cancelled out of them.

Indeed, that is Sati. I know about Sati. I'm referring to a male figure, on the ground. Not Sati.

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To say that only programs survived Smiths explosions seem silly to me, but I'll allow myself to be proved wrong.

That is not my position. All I said was that we have no positive proof that anyone survived the Smith-takeover, besides (maybe) Sati. And (1) Sati is a program and (2) she may have only survived because of the Oracle's help.

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Of course it won't be Neo though cause he'd be in the crater with the oracle and we could clearly see that he wasn't. Only the person who the Smith in the crater had posessed was in the crater. Neo has been spread through the matrix.

So who's the guy we see on the ground? Or am I wrong to begin with? I'm still unclear as to what your position is here.. why the cryptic posts?

I'm not being cryptic!

Smith is like a virus. Neo is the cure. Neo spreads through the matrix after being taken over curing all the people who were Smiths. The male figure used to be a Smith clone (like Sati was) and is now cured.

Ok?

If you DO in fact mean the person in the crater - that was the oracle and she was the smith clone who Neo was fighting in the crater.

1. Ok so you're saying it was just some random guy who'd been taken over by Smith. I can buy that (even if I'm surprised the W. bros would've bothered to show us "some random guy"), but I'd have to watch the film again before I'll be convinced. It's a reasonable explanation though.

2. I didn't see the Oracle in the crater or mud or anywhere at all! (Until the reboot and sunrise, then she's sitting on the bench.) But I'll take your word for it.

thanks,

The person lying in the crater on the mud is the Oracle, and after this scene where cat walks (deja vu) and matrix reboots or reloads or whatsoever, the person lying there near the cat is Sati. There are no other bodies around except these two.

And I'm 99% sure of this.

Weird.

Now I'm thinking that the most likely explanation is that I saw the Oracle in the mud, and couldn't tell it was the Oracle, and decided that it was some guy, just not Neo or Smith.

If this is true, then another interesting point is that the only two "people" we know about who survived the Smith virus/explosion are 1. Oracle and 2. Sati. In other words, AIs. Neo is completely gone, for example, even after Smith dies.

Doesn't that mean there are no living humans left in the Matrix? (man, it sucks to close one plot hole just to open up a new, wider one...)

Every time Standalone posts I lost the point of the argument cause I see that picture and think "m quadrilogy!"

Yeah I didn't see a body between those two that you just mentioned either - but, if I take it as red that there was one, my above opinion applies.

It's the Oracle.

Not two - three. You forgot about Seraph.

But even so I think we are supposed to presume that there are still humans in the matrix. I can't be sure of that mind you....

Fatpie42 wrote:

Ok I seriously can't believe no one else understands this. Agent Smith took over loads of people including the Oracle, Sati and Seraph - all of which were alive at the end Therefore after the smiths explode the matrix reorganises, all the people smith took over are lying where their smith-posessed bodies would have been. make sense?

i don't remember a body lying on the ground after Neo destroyed Smith in the first one. Smith had to be in a body then didn't he?

I noticed the body on the ground that you're talking about.. and I thought it looked like a man too. But my friend who was sitting next to me assured me that it was the Oracle, like a few people here have said.

In that case I think that's an interesting twist.. because would that make the Smith that Neo fought at the end the one that was copied into the Oracle? Is that why Smith kept making references as to how he "saw it" and how he "knew" things would happen during that fight? But of course, he couldn't see past Neo's choice to stand up and give himself over to Smith, so he didn't know that was going to happen.

Make sense?