Half-a-Hundred and counting
Posts: 66
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Hi Mariano,
First, let me ask you if you have seen The Animatrix: The Second Renaissance, parts 1 and 2. If you haven't seen it, I recommend that you do eventhough it is not really need to be seen. It does give some background information which pertains to the Matrix trilogy.
It can be downloaded from ->
It looks as though no one wants to reply to your post. So, I have decided to do so. The counter points I make are not made to put your theories down. They are just MY take on what you said. The ONLY ones who REALLY know are The Bros themselves.
The following is quite long, so please excuse it:
MAD-1138 wrote: | The first movie was quite straightforward. We all understood that the world of the future was dominated by the machines, which used mankind as batteries, and the matrix was a virtual reality to keep the "batteries" working. So far so good, but then... Reloaded came out.
In Reloaded, we are presented with many questions, and many answers, most of them given by the Architect. Let's go step by step. Smith has had a change in its code and now it can infect other "individuals" to transform them into Smiths, not only programs, but humans too. Neo doesn't know what to do next, until the Oracle tells him the path of the One ends at the source. Here we find out that the Oracle is also a program. Neo goes to the Merovingian to take the Keymaker, another program. The Merovingian gives one of the best speeches in the Trilogy, when he tells Neo and his friends that they do not realize they are being used. "The keymaker is a means to do something, but what?" Neo goes to find the keymaker because the Oracle told him to, not because he understand the WHY (which is, of course, to use him to open the door to the Source). In the meantime, Smith infects Bane and his persona is downloaded into Bane's real body. And finally, Neo meets the Architect, and we find out the rest. |
So far so good.
MAD-1138 wrote: | | He(The Architect) created the first Matrix (the one mentioned by Smith on the first movie, the one where everyone was happy, and the one that failed, causing the loss of many crops...). The Oracle, a program created to study the human psyque, finds the solution: give them a life exactly like the one they had at the end of the 20th century, with all the problems and sorrow, and give them the ability to chose. This solution worked, and 99% of the humans accepted the new Matrix. But there was a 1% that didn't, and, as the Architect says, if they were left on their own they would become a threat to the system. |
The people who found and modified the city that became known as Zion are most likely this 1% who did not accept the program.
MAD-1138 wrote: | | This Matrix is older than you think. The Architect meassures time from one emergence of the One to the next, and this is the sixth. There were five "Neo" before this one, and five Zion before this one, and they were all destroyed. Neo has to choose now between two doors. One leads to the Source, where the "code" he carries is reinserted to begin a new loop, and then he must pick some males and females to be unplugged to generate the new Zion. The other door leads back to his friends. If he chooses the first door, Zion is destroyed but the rest of mankind, plugged to the matrix, is saved (this is the solution the five Neos before this one choose). |
Yes, there were five other people/minds (not necessarily Neo himself) who became "The One" before Neo became "The One". Yes, Zion was destroyed five previous times because the previous "Ones" did not make the same choice as Neo did. The previous "Ones" chose to "save" all of the humanity that is connected to The Matrix, but NOT the people in Zion by reinserting the "code". Therefore, no peace was struck. The Machines destroy Zion and it's human population. Afterwhich, a group of minds is then released from The Matrix. These people find, repopulate and rebuild the city which came to be known as Zion (It may not have even been called Zion at the beginning). This cycle is to continue indefinately until a "One" finally chooses to accept his/her true destiny.
MAD-1138 wrote: | | If he chooses the second door, he goes back and tries to save Zion, but risk a system crash and the death of all the humans still "plugged". He chooses to go back, and then we see he has powers on the "real world". |
Yes, Neo chooses the door that "The One" is destined to choose. He makes the choice that all the previous ones did not, but where supposed to. He chooses the door which leads to possible the fulfillment of the Prophecy - Ending the war. The disconnected humans are saved. The cycle is terminated.
MAD-1138 wrote: | | Now, you just have to think a little and the answer is obvious... NEO is a program! How else could he be the sixth version of himself? (look at the faces on the monitors, they are all Keanu). He has a function and it is to reinsert the code to "reload" the matrix = he is a program. He has to unplug some people to begin the new Zion = he is the first one who gives the profecy that the One will come one day to end the war (see the first movie, morpheus says that). All the Ones have imprinted on them the "love" for mankind, which helps them to decide, at the end, to take the door to the Source and save all the humans plugged to the matrix, but this one is different, because he focused that "love" in one individual: Trinity, and then he choses the other door and refuse to continue the loops = he is a program again... |
IMHO, Neo, like the other human minds in The Matrix, is ONLY a program when he is IN The Matrix. Meaning, when in The Matrix, their minds become digitized. This holds true for the people still attached to The system. Their minds are digitized into The Matrix. Neo is not necessarily the sixth version of himself. The previous "Ones" could have been their own individual selves which could have led their own lives within The Matrix until that day came when they were given the choice to leave in order to become "The One". They were all lead down the path to accomplish their ultimate function. This function is fulfill The Prophecy. Yes, The Prophecy IS true. However, before Prohecy can be fulfilled, the appropriate choice must be made. Neo, unknowingly, chooses THE door which leads to the possible fulfillment of The Prophecy. This was played out in Revolutions. Neo, the most recent and last "One" ends the war by bringing about peace between the humans and machines. Thereby terminating the vicious cycle. Prophecy fulfilled. Oh, about the Neo's on the screens in Reloaded. I do not believe this was meant to show the lives of previous "Ones". I feel that it is just survalence(sp) video taken of him within The Matrix by The System. The Architect, since he created The Matrix, is able to access survalence(sp) video of anyone inside the Matrix he chooses.
MAD-1138 wrote: | | Now, let me prove my theory. How could he be a program if he is a human in Zion? ZION IS NOT REAL. That explains why he has powers in the "real world". How could Smith download into the real Bane? This is ridiculous, remember the matrix is a virtual world, and the people is not uploaded into it, therefore, they cannot be downloaded. The Matrix is a virtual reality, and the "real world" is another virtual reality. |
IMHO, Zion and The Machine City/01/The System/hardware ARE real. The ONLY virtual world is that of The Matrix/software. Smith, after his interaction with Neo at the end of The Matrix(M1), started to become more than JUST a program. Just as Neo started to become more the JUST human. Even before that interaction in M1, Neo was becoming or gradually realizing that he was more then just human. Remember, Neo is Smith and Smith is Neo. They have their powers because they are trancending beyond their respective worlds. "The One" can be thought of as the Second Coming of Christ and Smith can be thought of as being the Anti-Chist. THIS is how they are able to do what they can do. This would include Smith being able to exit The Matrix via Bane. If you think of it the way I put it in the sentence - "The One" can be thought of as the Second Coming of Christ and Smith can be thought of as being the Anti-Chist - it's not ridiculous. It ends up making sense. At least, to me anyway.
MAD-1138 wrote: | It's all a game, played between the Architect and the Oracle. The Architect creates a world where he has slave programs, and the Oracle tries to liberate as many as possible before the inevitable: the reloading of the Matrix. There are different kind of programs: the ones who are part of the system (I called them "software"), and the humans. The Oracle uses the humans as pawns, while the Architect uses the agents, Smith, the Merovingian, etc. Both the "software" and the "human" programs have a function. If they don't, they face deletion unless they are freed. If they are freed, the "humans" go to the "real world" to choose their destiny, while the "software" are allowed to live in the matrix whithout a function, like Sati, Seraph, the ones partying at HELL, etc. At the end, the Architect wins if he reloads the matrix and destroys all the humans, eleminating this new emergence of the flaw (as many of you know, an operating system has the same problem. After many days working, many flaws appear and they system starts to hang, and then you must reboot the computer to reload it. - So, the objective of the Architect is to keep collecting these "system bugs" which we call humans, and deposit them on the trashcan called "Zion". To do this he uses his "garbage collector", Neo, and all the rebellion he generates when he reinserts his code and starts a new loop. The Oracle never fully wins, because she cannot destroy the matrix, but she has a victory if the freed humans are allowed to live. This is the first time she has this victory, and that's why the Architect congratulates her for playing such a dangerous game. What she did this time that she never did before was to play with Trinity. Remeber it's the Oracle who tells Trinity that she'll love the One (Matrix 1), maybe forcing her unconsciously to love him. This way the Oracle made sure that this Neo would care a little more for the Zion humans. The machines do not need Neo to stop Smith. It was inevitable that Neo would return to the source and reload the Matrix (revolution it), so finally the Architect accepts peace in exchange for reloading. Neo understand this when he allows Smith to infect him, ending the circle and beginning a new one...
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It's a game, but not in the actual sense of the word. It's a metaphorical game.
The Architect creates the first Matrix to hold the "batteries" minds as a Utopia. The minds would not accept this. Another Matrix was created which reflected human civilization at it's peak. It worked, but numbers of minds would still not accept it. In steps The Oracle with the "solution" - choice. This worked, but 1% of minds still would not accept The Matrix. This created a new "problem" - the anomoly of "The One". The Oracle most likely somehow knew beforehand that this would happen. Like she said in Revolutions, her purpose is to unbalnce the equastion. She could have been "planted" into The Matrix by someone or something to do just that. If she was "planted" then who planted her? Who knows? However, this really isn't important. She is there to do what she is supposed to do - guide "The One" to fulfill The Prophecy. The function of the human minds within The Matrix is to just live their own lives as if NOTHING has happened, whilst their bodies are used as "batteries". That's it. Nothing more, except for serving as Agents when needed.
After "The One" finally reaches The Architect, what he(The Architect) wants is to have the disconnected humans destroyed. He doens't want the the cycle to start again because this defeats the purpose of the disconnected humans being destroyed once and for all. He does not want reinsertion of the code to repopulate Zion. He wants the destruction to be done and over with.
This is why I once theorized that The Architect wanted "The One" to choose the door which Neo ended up choosing because the choice of this door is the most logical one which could potentially lead to the didconnected humans being destroyed once and for all. However, because choice is the rule, The Architect had to offer another choice of doors - the one which leads to reinsertion. This choice would begin the cycle again, but it had to be given.
The Architect is willing to lay it all on the line that Neo will be killed if he chooses the door which the other "ones" did not - the one which Neo chose. This is the most logical choice because if "The One"/the anomoly/Neo is killed, no peace accord will be reached. If no peace accord is reached, then all of the disconnected humans are destroyed. Plus, since Neo did not choose reinsertion, no other minds will be freed unless they can free themselves like The Kid. Of course, there was no way that The Architect could know what would actually transpire in Revolutions. Well, he might have theorized the probability of it, but this probability might have been so low to him, that he was wiling to gamble.
The love issue was definately a part of the "game". Both The Oracle and The Architect used it for an advantage. It is apparant how The Oracle used it, but less apparant how The Architect used it. Going back to my statements above concerning The Architect wanting Neo to choose the door he chose, he(The Architect) used Neo's love for Trinity to "help" him choose HER instead of ALL within The Matrix.
The Machines DID need Neo to stop Smith because there was no way that they could do it themselves. Smith was no longer linked to The System. He became a "virus" which would have continued to spread until it leaked out into The System. If Neo did not "clean" this virus that was Smith, Smith would have eventually corrupted the entire Machine City. If the Machine's REALLY did not need Neo to help, they would have NOT agreed to let Neo fight Smith. Who knows, maybe The Machines were unknowingly following The Prophecy by allowing Neo to go back inside to battle Smith. Originally, they did want peace with the humans, but that peace was denied by the humans because it was the humans who started the war in the first place.
Like I said way above, the counter points I make are not made to put your theories down. They are just MY take on what you said. The ONLY ones who REALLY know are The Bros themselves.
What is the Matrix
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