»Peace ?«

Maybe I'm wrong but I thought the part in Rev about Sati and her parents was to show that machines or AI experienced human emotions (love). That is why the oracle was so important because she possibly developed these emotions as other programs did (or maybe they had them all along). She was one that was obviously a part of the machine world but still wanted the war stopped. I don't think it's far fetched to say that many other machines and programs felt the same and wanted peace.

Twelfth Sword wrote:

I stopped reading posts at lysander's because no one seems to get it. Smith is taking over the Matrix. He is infecting the Matrix. Now most of you that don't believe Smith can take over the system, remember that he's a virus and he's slowly taking control of the system (changing the city, infecting everyone, etc). As far as we are concerned, from the evidence in the movie, the Matrix needs NEO to survive. Thats it. No, "but why doesn't the architect just format and install XP?" crap. Theres no format, theres no reboot. The movie makes it prefectly clear that the mahcines need neo <----- a human being. Neo has proved he's worth as a human being. The machines see the value in humanity. After all, the matrix has a conciousness so whos to say that it can't understand for the sack of understanding? ie, revolution. The point of the movie....

You're wrong.

The movie makes it clear that the machines need Neo to stop Smith, because they are afraid that Smith will infiltrate the machine city; the problem is that this is easily preventable. They are not afraid the matrix crashing, and there's no reason why they can't shut it down.

Transcript:

Neo: The program 'Smith' has grown beyond your control. Soon he will spread through this city as he spread through the Matrix. You cannot stop him, but I can.
Deus Ex Machina: What do you want?
Neo: Peace.

(I assume all who read this understands that this is first time peace has existed between name and machine since the 2nd Renaissance. It's not a cyclic phenomenon that happens everytime Zion is flushed and the Matrix is rebooted. No other Zion population has never survived a reloading of the Matrix.)
I think it is important to consider the machines, all of them, not just those connected to the Matrix. 01 or The Machine City consists of millions if not billions of machines. These machines all have their own OS software, and many if not all have an AI complex enough to consider them sentient life. It is very possible that the machines have a democracy or a republic or a form of mass government to some degree. Historically, democracies tend to embrace peace as often as possible. The Deus Ex Machine/Machine God face may have been 01's mayor or it could been the President/Premier/Emperor of the nation of machines or it could have been the collective consciousness of the machines all over the world. I doubt the Architect is the highest ranked program in the machines' society, but I'm sure many programs and machines percieve peace with the humans as preferable to conflict.
Selfish interests of individual programs may also have played a role. Given that the machines' AI originally came from us, selfserving interests that manifest in humanity could conceivably arise in the machines. The Merovingian is a perfect example. His information trafficking business would boom if Zion and 01 began interacting on a more frequent and more amicable basis. Given the amount of influence he appears to command within the Matrix, I'm sure he can also make things happen in the machine realm in general.

The peace will last because the prophecy was fulfilled. This means that the rebel humans will no longer long for a savior. They will simply live their lives in Zion.

The objection is raised that the machines will lose "millions or billions" of batteries. I am not so sure. Recall that only less than 1% ever question the Matrix to begin with.

Most people will go on living happily inside the Matrix. The only thing which has now changed is that the Zionites no longer will struggle against the machines, agents, squids, etc.; instead, they will simply live their lives in Zion, dancing, having sex, etc.

Why? Because "the war is over". There is "peace", just like the prophecy said their would be. Nothing more to fight for now.

Note: if you think that this state of affairs essentially means that the machines have won the war for good... I happen to think you're right.

Lysander I don't even need to comment because you just proved my point,
not to mention that you contridict yourself in each new sentence...the dialogue you supplied proves my point exactly...the machines need Neo, they can't get rid of Smith without him, no reboot.

Neo: The program 'Smith' has grown beyond your control. Soon he will spread through this city as he spread through the Matrix. You cannot stop him, but I can.
Deus Ex Machina: What do you want?
Neo: Peace.

So what are you going on about?

Twelfth Sword wrote:

Lysander I don't even need to comment because you just proved my point, not to mention that you contridict yourself in each new sentence...the dialogue you supplied proves my point exactly...the machines need Neo, they can't get rid of Smith without him, no reboot. Neo: The program 'Smith' has grown beyond your control. Soon he will spread through this city as he spread through the Matrix. You cannot stop him, but I can. Deus Ex Machina: What do you want? Neo: Peace. So what are you going on about?

Please read more carefully. You said that the machines are worried about Smith crashing the matrix, which is not true. The machines are worried that Smith will escape the matrix into the machine world.

This is impossible, though, because the only way from the matrix to the machine world is the trainstation, and the machines control the trains. Furthermore, there is no reason given why the machines cannot simply turn off the matrix, erradicating Smith, and start over with the fetuses from the Fetus Fields.

bunraku wrote:

Hi I just can't see peace lasting. Some people think this is the normal rebooting of the Matrix and has happened before.But i disagree because even the Oracle asked"How long will the peace last". So this was a new experience for her too. Are the machines really going to accept Millions or Billions of their Batteries leaving their Pods? And why did ther Architech keep his word? He's done this at least 5 times before and as a machine it would seem logical to do this again. The machines gain nothing from the peace apart from a loss of Power resources. One the Smiths were defeated why did'nt he just let the second group of sentinels destroy Zion apart from 23 Individuals for breeding? In fact they have plenty breeding stock in the pods. Anyone seen Star Trek Voyager. The Borg and Voyager made a pact against species 8472. The Borg have only one purpose in life. Assimilation. Once the deal was up they went straight back after Voyager with a Vengeance. And the Machines have 1 purpose. Killing Free Humans and keeping their power supply going. As soon as the Smith Virus was removed'it should have been business as usual for the Architech and Machines. Just my 2 assholes.

I also don't think that this rebooting or whatever you want to call it is exactly happening like in the past. But i do not agree with the idea that the only thing the machines want is power supply. I am sticking with the idea of evolving TOGETHER, please tell me what do you think

I never said i thouight Smith would crash the system.

Furthermore, There is no evidence in the movie that suggests the matrix can reboot itself. All we know is that it needs Neo to get rid of the infestation. Thats it. I never said Smith was going to reboot the system. Read my previous posts more careful before you start argueing with me. We are almost saying THE SAME THING.

about the Matrix being rebooted....it is possible for a computer to be rebooted and the programs to be "saved". Remember they are programs....which means they can be edited, deleted, or saved.
Think of it like this....

When you re-install your "windows" do u not save the most important things you believe valuable to you?

And about Smith rebooting the system; If a computer is heavily infected with a virus it will destroy the clusters in the hard drive, thus the computer will seize to function So yes, Smith could of taken full control of the Matrix and done whatever he wanted with it. After all that is the meaning of a virus is it not? To take control of a program and exploit it.

And oh yea....about shutting down the matrix...dont u think that shutting down the Matrix wont kill the humans in the cacoons? It's the life support for the human brain...without that its bye bye humans and bye bye machines.

yeah, youre right, and besides, that won't happen, cause 99% of them won't accept the truth, so theyre better of inside the matrix, so, the machines are happy and the humans are happy.

Benjamin wrote:

Quote:

yeah, youre right, and besides, that won't happen, cause 99% of them won't accept the truth, so theyre better of inside the matrix, so, the machines are happy and the humans are happy.

Well this is the deal, those that want to stay plugged in are able to stay that way and the rest can be unplugged and free - a compromise was reached that suited everybody...

the oracle said peace would only last "as long as it can."
aside from a power source, machines need humans to provide them w/a purpose.
machines are just machines: considering how they acknowledge the importance of anomolies in *any* system, they realize only humans can provide those anomalies. w/out anomalies--interactions--there is no point to existence, and every program needs a purpose.
each zion, its population carefully controlled by cyclical anihilations, adds its own color and flavor to the otherwise barren system. there *is* evoltuion, a controlled and extremely manipulated evolution, but still it provides some of the necessary impetus.
but as in all evolution, it's the "catastrophic event " that really gets the chain reaction going and proceeds in directions not even most computer programs can foresee. the oracle realized this, and tried to guide the event as well as she could so that both worlds--human and machine--wouldn't be wiped out from the ensuing aftermath of the catastrophe (the catastrophe in this case being neo).
the war started in the first place because a program is only as good as its input, and its input apparently had only very shallow concepts about the point of existence. so the program "thought" existence was all about order and harmony and tried to impose them; man thought otherwise and rebelled.
and the whole point of neo is that he became the BYPASS of the train station--the oracle was able to transmit the deletion code to smith through neo. neo was indeed a new thing--he didn't just follow the path, he *was* the path at the end of his life. as such, everyone concerned became aware that the balance of power had made an enormous shift. the firewall had been breached, as it were.
but as in all things, once a balance is achieved, everyone gets bored w/it and feels the need for a little confrontation to fan away the brain fog...
nin

On the official site, the brothers said that "As individuals, it seems that peace may be something that is attainable, but as a group, history sadly suggests that it is an improbability, if not an impossibility."

So you have your answer, peace won't last ...

source :
whatisthematrix.warnerbros.com...