»Does the "Kid" have Purpose?«

What purpose does the Kid have? (the kid that frees himself in the Animatrix) Does he have any other purpose other than to help open the 3rd gate? He seems more unique than the others that were freed from the Matrix, because he "unplugged" himself. Anyone have any Ideas... I was just curious. Could the kid be the next "one"? I don't know, I just thought i'd throw it out there.

Purpose for the Kid..haha you sound like a Machine...

The Kid believes he has a purpose, his purpose was to be exactly where he was WHEN he was supposed to be there. He saved Neo's life from Bane when he delivered the spoon to neo, and he also opened the gate at the last possible second to allow the Hammer to enter zion, buying the humans more time for Neo to do his Jesus thing.

MrWizard wrote:

Purpose for the Kid..haha you sound like a Machine...

No he doesn't.

That's just you who thinks that.

I do not know but since he freed himself I think that he might be the next One.

Notice how the kid is so fatalist. 'I believe', 'Its meant to be' etc.

He believes so much that he was able to risk everything, and free himself. I think that he is a symbol of true faith, that with sheer faith and unfaliable determination one can find the truth for themselves.

DaVinci wrote:

I do not know but since he freed himself I think that he might be the next One.

Crisis Four wrote:

I think that he is a symbol of true faith, that with sheer faith and unfaliable determination one can find the truth for themselves.

I think you guys are both right to an extent. First, the Kid is religion when it's working, when it's faith. He's an alternative to Morpheus' dogmatic insanity.

I think he is not the next One, but more probably a likely candidate to have been the true anomoly. Neo required coaxing just to get to the level of being able to know there was a Matrix (and that was after he'd seen the pods, he still denies it and vomits). But not the Kid. He knows Neo and shows no shock at seeing the interior of the Neb from the first moment he opens his eyes for the first time in the real world.

The Kid could self eject, and I think one day probably could have gone back in to change the Matrix any way he saw fit, like the missing original anomaly who was not a One but a true messiah.

The Kid is one of the major characters in my M4 (and the only character from the original trilogy to make it into my sequel).

Then to truly make the kid work in anything of this magnitude.. given that the kid has no tether, the kid must be a serious brat...

I.E.: Kid is in the garage, sharpening a most wick-ed blade... A nosy unwelcome guest/spectator says, "You sure are getting it Sharp!".. thereby momentarily breaking his "spell".. the "spell" that it takes to do a truly good sharpening...
Kid grins through vengeance's eyes, and says as he grabs the pest's arm tightly.. "Well It's so sharp I could do painless surgery with it"...


Everyone who frees themself is the next to free themselves..
Only by acts of naive innocence and tender purity is it reality...
Proof that without "the brat" something is nothing...

CaptPostMod wrote:

...the Kid is religion when it's working, when it's faith.

Capt., I disagree.
His believe merely gets him to Zion. But we know from Neo that Zion is by far not the end of the path.

CaptPostMod wrote:

...Neo required coaxing just to get to the level of being able to know there was a Matrix (and that was after he'd seen the pods, he still denies it and vomits). But not the Kid. He knows Neo and shows no shock at seeing the interior of the Neb from the first moment he opens his eyes for the first time in the real world. The Kid could self eject,...

We should not forget that the kid was "guided" out of the Matrix by Neo, the One, himself.

I believe the big difference between Neo and the kid is that Neo seeks, and eventually finds, the truth in himself (-> know thyself), whereas the kids tries to find salvation in another,... in Neo.

Kid: You saved me.
Neo: You saved yourself

But the kid wouldn't listen...

From what I know of MXO, Morpheus and the kid, who both represent different qualities of (blind) believe, can't follow Neo to the end. They fail in truly understanding the truce -> in their blind believe in Neo, they both eventually betray his peace.

I understand this as a statement that believe can only get you that far,... eventually it must turn into knowledge/understanding -> know thyself

tozy wrote:

Capt., I disagree. His believe merely gets him to Zion. But we know from Neo that Zion is by far not the end of the path.

MxO aside, the Kid's belief does much more than merely get him to Zion. It saves the dock, Morpheus, Niobe, Link, and everyone on the Hammer. "Neo, I believe ..." with those words the Kid is able to do anything.

Knowing thyself is a Path to salvation/enlightenment. But there can also be entrusting yourself to a higher self, to The One you know can empower you to reach that salvation.

Namo Amida Butsu ... Neo, I believe.

Perhaps true faith, dogma and complete believe can give great strength. We see that through the Kid's aboloute belief, he is able to acomplish great things.

However, he is not willing to accept that his beliefs are shrouded in dogma and specifics. Neo, however, has the ability to see through this dogma, and reach the one stage of complete enlightenment - to see the world for all it is worth.

Could this be a little hint that true enlightenment cannot be gained through blind following of religion?

No enLIGHTenment can be gained through BLIND anything, be it belief or disbelief.

Well, was Neo sure of his mission when he went to the Machine City?

Maybe his whole trip was an act of faith on his part. By knowing himself, he took a huge leap of faith by doing what he did.

The Kid's pretty much Neo's opposite when it comes to faith, but then by the end of the movie, maybe not?

CaptPostMod wrote:

MxO aside, the Kid's belief does much more than merely get him to Zion. It saves the dock, Morpheus, Niobe, Link, and everyone on the Hammer. "Neo, I believe ..." with those words the Kid is able to do anything.

Within Zion he can do a lot.
However,... "anything" would have meant to safe Mifune, to stop the sentinels for good, to end the war, etc. etc.

CaptPostMod wrote:

Knowing thyself is a Path to salvation/enlightenment. But there can also be entrusting yourself to a higher self, to The One you know can empower you to reach that salvation.

But where will you find salvation in the end?

Kid: You saved me.
Neo: You saved yourself.

I think, pre Neo becoming the One, and without being in contact with Neo,... the kid would not have been able to free himself from the Matrix.
However,...as Neo said, he did free himself.
Neo is a means for him, not the end. The kid just doesn't yet understand it.

CaptPostMod wrote:

Namo Amida Butsu ... Neo, I believe.

It is my understanding that Amida Buddha has two meanings:

1. a historical person...
2. ... symbolizing universal Buddahood

Since Buddha nature (or universal spirit as our very essence) is so damn hard to grasp for the human mind, I believe, mankind needs help. Amida Buddha (just as Krishna or other personifications of Spirit Supreme) is a focus for the mind. Faith in Amida Buddha, I believe, does focus the mind at the path towards a person's own buddhahood -> know thyself.

Aquin wrote:

Well, was Neo sure of his mission when he went to the Machine City?

I would say so:
_________________________

Neo is alone, sitting on the bunk, looking for his own answer.

Again he focuses and sees something that is there, but not there: the Desert of the Real. A dark scorched plane of earth marked by the three black lines that pull us closer and closer until--

He blinks and the image is gone.
__________________________
(Revolutions shooting script)

He didn't yet know what would expect him, but he was sure that this is where he would find the answer.

Aquin wrote:

Maybe his whole trip was an act of faith on his part. By knowing himself, he took a huge leap of faith by doing what he did.

I'd put it that way:
He knew that the machine city would be the place where he would be able to make peace. And it turned out that know thyself would be the end of the war.

Just reread that part of the script. He was sure of what he had to do, but not sure what he would do once he got there.

Maybe then the Kid and Neo's perspective on faith/destiny are opposite, but both did great things to save Zion. (of course ultimately Neo did more, but w/o the Kid, I doubt Neo would have had the extra time.)

tozy wrote:

I think, pre Neo becoming the One, and without being in contact with Neo,... the kid would not have been able to free himself from the Matrix.

So you think that Neo is the sole force behind the Kid's emancipation? I do not think this. As I said, I think the Kid was more likely a future natural One as oppossed to the machine's programmed One (Neo).

tozy wrote:

Since Buddha nature (or universal spirit as our very essence) is so damn hard to grasp for the human mind, I believe, mankind needs help. Amida Buddha (just as Krishna or other personifications of Spirit Supreme) is a focus for the mind. Faith in Amida Buddha, I believe, does focus the mind at the path towards a person's own buddhahood -> know thyself.

Just what I've said. The Kid's faith in Neo is his focus. He uses that faith to assist him in performing his wildly heroic acts.

Also, if we are all one, then how does faith in another differ from faith in oneself. And, you've said that love of Trinity (I think you were on that side of the argument) allowed Neo to further himself, how is this then different?

If to bend the spoon you must bend yourself, what does that tell you about your relationship to the spoon?

Quote: "I believe ... with those words the Kid is able to do anything."


Anything, but act mature, responsible, collected, righteous, and so on.... Isn't that why "the kid"... Isn't the kid, us..?

cosmicbrat wrote:

Quote: "I believe ... with those words the Kid is able to do anything." Anything, but act mature, responsible, collected, righteous, and so on.... Isn't that why "the kid"... Isn't the kid, us..?

He may initially lack some refinement, but I would hesitate to call him immature for his age.

And remember, "with those words." Without those words he is just a kid. But when his belief and determination are awakened in him, he takes on Mifune's mature responsibilities, collects himself to get into the war suit that he doesn't even know how to drive, righteouslly takes up the battle with the machines, and saves the crews of the Neb, Logos, and Hammer along with the dock...

He is the Kid, though. And perhaps this is a childish concept of faith. To put faith in a transcendent being who can take on your insecurity and doubt and guide you to the strength and courage to do what must be done... But I don't think so.

Namu Amida Butsu!

CaptPostMod wrote:

So you think that Neo is the sole force behind the Kid's emancipation?

No, not the sole force. But I believe he paved the path for the kid to free himself from the Matrix, as in:

those that refused the program, while a minority, if unchecked, would constitute an escalating probability of disaster

and:

Neo, I believe. I know it wans't a dream. - kid's story

Capt wrote:

I think the Kid was more likely a future natural One as oppossed to the machine's programmed One (Neo).

Hm,... I still don't believe Neo is a programmed One...

Capt. wrote:

Just what I've said. The Kid's faith in Neo is his focus. He uses that faith to assist him in performing his wildly heroic acts. Also, if we are all one, then how does faith in another differ from faith in oneself. And, you've said that love of Trinity (I think you were on that side of the argument) allowed Neo to further himself, how is this then different?

I believe there is a difference between focusing on...

1. a historical person...
2. ... symbolizing universal Buddahood

and focusing on another separate identity.

As for Trinity: it is not believe in her that allows him to further himself, but their bond -> she opens his perception to another perspective.
And, I believe, theirs is a bond of unconditioned, selfless, love (-> see architect room -> matrix-explained.com...). Their relationship forshadows,... and grows Neo towards his ultimate act of selflessness in the end.

You know, Capt, mine is propabely a very personal interpretation. I understand believe as a means, a bridge, to gain knowledge.
But I am extremly sceptical of blind believe. Too many horrors have happened (and happen right now) out of blind believe.

tozy wrote:

You know, Capt, mine is propabely a very personal interpretation. I understand believe as a means, a bridge, to gain knowledge. But I am extremly sceptical of blind believe. Too many horrors have happened (and happen right now) out of blind believe.

I think that my interpretation is a bit personal as well. Since I rallied against the specific vision of the Jehovah of Genesis as a creator God, it's largely been assumed that I have no personal transcendent being to whom I pledge my spiritual trust.

Of course, this is very misunderstood, because I very much do put my spiritual trust in another. My faith, of course, is not in a physical being but a mythical one.

It's not blind faith, because I would not do anything the other said without first testing it against my inner dharma. This seems true of the Kid as well. We're never shown the Kid being trained in anything by Neo, and he certainly isn't overly willing to follow Neo's orders like "Go away Kid, you're bothering me." In fact, the Kid brings Neo spiritual advice in the form of delivering the spoon!

The Kid seems to see Neo as a power to call on to burn away his own uncertainty. It is not Neo the person that the Kid calls on ever in the films or the Animatrix. It is Neo the Tathagata. Neo the Christ. Neo the one who Enlightened Himself proving that all people can attain enlightenment.

I call on Amida Buddha (though I'm officially Zen, I blend in a decent amount of Pure Land, which is very common in the East, though not so in the West). I call on him to remind me that all people's are protected by the Bodhisattva vow to not rest until every mind is free. Until every mind is shown a world without rules or boundaries... amazon.com...

Neo, I believe...

Hm,... what is the difference between you and the kid, between faith and, as I understand it, blind believe?

Capt wrote:

My faith, of course, is not in a physical being but a mythical one

And the myth "defines" Amida Buddha. You know, in accordance with the teachings of your religion, the "outcome" of your faith in Amida Buddha. You know that your faith in him will help you to... "know thyself".

The kid, however, only knows Neo, the One who is powerful in their fight against the machines, and may - somehow - save them.

What do you think?

tozy wrote:

The kid, however, only knows Neo, the One who is powerful in their fight against the machines, and may - somehow - save them. What do you think?

Based on what you've said about MxO, this must be the direction to go in. The films themselves seemed more open than this to me (the Kid is searching to the end of the lonely suffering he experiences in the Samsara of the Matrix and finds it in himself by calling on Neo). But if MxO is portraying him as a zealot, then I think your idea is the correct one.

Of course, the same happens in any religion. In Christianity, some followers see Christ as a sovereign power who will help their armies conquer the armies oppossed to him. However some see Christ as an awakened being who can help guide them towards their own awakening.

It depends on whether or not your goal is rooted in establishing power in Samsara or breaking free to Nirvana. Of course, once the Kid has reached the Samadhi of Zion, he may well have lost the desire to rise further. Believing Zion to be freedom, he fights for it, though it is just another world in Samsara.

Maybe that the Kid was freed by the machines ? I mean, even Neo can't jack out by himself (or else he would have done it during the Burly brawl but instead, he needed to fly away first).

But the Kid got out of the Matrix by himself, wich is suspicious to me. I think that he was there indeed to save Neo from Bane.

Or maybe that he would have been the One if the Oracle didn't choose someone "different" this time.

Yes his purpose is to open the gates for the hammer.

But to go deeper

The five stages of man...

spoon boy... childhood...inocent
The Kid.. adolecent...confused
Neo...young man...peak
Mero... Mature Man...prick
Architect... Old Age...logic dictator

The Kid represents the next generation.